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Author: Jonathan Choi   |   Latest post: Sat, 6 Jul 2019, 5:16 PM

 

(CHOIVO CAPITAL) Solving the Malaysian Property Overhang Problem within 2 years.

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For a copy with better formatting, go here, its alot easier on the eyes.

Solving the Malaysian Property Overhang Problem within 2 years.

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Since 2014, the property development industry has been in the doldrums, with property overhang in Malaysia hitting a peak of RM19.86 billion in 2018.

 

Interestingly, Johor reported RM36.75 billion worth of unsold property (including commercial units), which is oddly higher than the entire Malaysian Property overhang value. They likely use different methods of computation, which I will not go through as its not relevant.

 

However, I think most of the unsold property in Johor is from those crazy china property development companies, so the effect should be pretty contained. Who on earth would ever buy a 1mil condo in JB, that is built on reclaimed land in the outskirts, crazy.

 

Like most Asian countries, property prices here are extremely elevated due to,

  1. Low home deposit rates of 10% or less. Pre-2008 crisis, in western countries, deposits to purchase a house was typically 20-30%.
     
  2. Long loan tenures of 35 years.

     
  3. The Asian predilection towards property due to the ability to leverage up 10X, and the good fortune bestowed upon the previous generation (who bought in urban areas), due to the geometric increase in population density in urban areas over the last 40 years.

 

This resulted in property in developed countries, selling at prices which indicate yields far below the risk-free rate. Without AirBnB, you are likely getting at best 3-4% yield. Which is utterly insane when Housing Loan is 4.8% and FD at 4.2%.

 

The key thing to note here is, the desirability of the property is not the problem, it’s the affordability.

 

 

 

Solving the Problem

So, how do we solve this? Well, it’s pretty straightforward. Nothing sells as well as “Greed” and “Hope”. Mix those two in and add a sprinkle of “Financial Engineering”.

 

Per year, Magnum and Berjaya Toto, sells about RM8 billion worth of lottery tickets. This does not include the illegal lottery sales in Malaysia.

 

Many of you are likely to be able to guess where i'm going at by now. Now, here is how I would go about it.

 

  1. The government is to create a SPV, that is allowed to sell Lottery Tickets (We won’t call it that, I’ll explain later). Except the prizes are houses.

    Allow property developers to sell (on consignment) properties they are unable to sell to the company, at cost plus 3% and/or 25% lower than bank valuation prices. For the sake of illustration, let’s say,

    Bank Value: RM1,000,000

    Price paid to developer: RM750,000 




     
  2. Make the odds such that it’s a zero-profit venture. And the key thing here is, to declare the value of the property, which will be the prize, at the Bank Valuation. Thus making it, technically, a positive Expected Value bet. Example,

    Bank Value/Prize: RM1,000,000 house

    Price Paid by SPV to developer: RM750,000

    Value of Tickets Sold: RM760,000 (additional 10k to cover cost)


    With this structuring, one can now market this as a Positive Expected Value Bet, which no lottery in the world can do.

    IE, if you think the bank valuation is the right price, you are statistically ensured of making a profit, if you buy enough tickets. Thus, making it a “wise” financial decision.

    If the government wants, they can even add in an escalating odds feature (tied to your IC), where the more tickets you buy, the higher your probability of winning a higher value property.

    And if you won a property, the value of the property is set off against the total value of your ticket purchases, with a cap of zero, removing the escalating odds, unless you start buying more tickets again.

    In addition, for those immensely unlucky individuals who spent tens/hundreds of thousands buying tickets without winning, they are given the option to set off value of the tickets bought, against the value of the house they want to buy directly from the pool.

    Properties won, cannot be sold for a period of 3-5 years.

 

 

The problem with the property market, now, is not that people don’t want to buy property. They can’t afford to buy it, and/or they don’t want to be tied down with a 30-year loan.

 

With this, suddenly it’s buying a house is not about getting bogged down with a 30-year loan. But to buy RM100 worth of tickets a month. Which turns it from “serious” money into “fun” money. And there is a lot more of the money in the fun category.

 

And if the marketing is done properly,

  1. Strong Emphasis on the positive EV of the bet across all the local newspapers and online news portals.

     
  2. EVERY win is splayed across the newspaper or online news portal with happy reactions from the winners etc.

 

I don’t see why it would not be possible to sell at minimum RM10 billion worth of houses in a year. Especially since the youth market, which this Malaysian lottery companies have been completely unable to capture, would be likely to buy the bulk of it.

 

However, how do we make it RM20 billion in sales? 

 

 

 

Tapping into the Halal Market.

For this idea to really work, we need to access into the remaining 75% of the population in a legal way.

 

Make no mistake, Gambling (“Maysir”) is illegal under Islam. However so is earning interest (“Riba”).

 

Currently, every single Muslim in the world owe a debt to Anwar Ali. He was the man who changed "interest" to "profit on investment". Before he did so, banks worldwide were so very sensitive to Muslims religious scruples, that they made sure to not pay interest on any deposits.

 

It’s amazing what a simple bit of linguistic gymnastics can do.

 

What are “Sukuk” bonds, except for asset backed/secured bonds? Which Malaysia was the first to issue, before most of the other Islamic countries followed suit. If one wants to see the full extent of the creativity in linguistics gymnastics, just take a read at a Sukuk Prospectus.

 

So how can the government do it?

 

Well, first of all don’t call it a lottery ticket, call it a lucky draw (“Cabutan Bertuah”). 

 

For something to be a lucky draw, it needs to have a characteristic where whatever is bought, would be the same price if it didn’t have the “lucky draw” aspect. The tickets/vouchers need to be given after a purchase. 

 

It can therefore also be structured to be a lucky draw (“Cabutan Bertuah”) as such,

 

  1. Donate to the government and get a lucky draw voucher. If you want you can continue holding the voucher to the lucky draw, if you don’t want, you opt to not take the voucher.

     
  2. Joint venture with companies where they can sell special edition/limited run goods (different taste, design etc) which include a number of these lucky draw vouchers or incorporate these vouchers into their products. Again if you want, you can opt to not take the vouchers.

    Companies that sell essential goods and fast-moving consumer goods are essential.

 

 

And most of all, at no point, do you ever want to bring any aspect of religion into it and start up unnecessary discussions. Keep it purely secular.

 

The goal is to make it such that it would be easy to make the leap. People with different religious interpretations can just as easily choose not to buy the special goods. 

 

 

 

 

 

The Downside

Unless I’m mistaken, ASB once did this lucky draw (cabutan bertuah) thing, for motor vehicles. However, some people complaint that it was haram, and it was brought to an end.

 

If the government were to do this, and be foolish enough to say that it is Halal, it would be political and religious suicide, where you will start a whole new competition to see who is the most religious and can denounce this the loudest.

 

In addition, if these currently frozen properties were released into the market, it would likely to accelerate the depression of property value to its real value due to demand to buy property outright drying up.

 

It should further accelerate once the 3-5 year freeze is over.

 

However, it is likely to be gradual instead of sudden, as there is no major liquidity crunch beneath it.

 

There is a big difference between, everyone had a 30-year loan they can’t pay and are forced to sell a property, and someone who won a house in a lottery and in no rush to sell, but wouldn’t mind the money.

 

 

 

 

 

Conclusion.

This was a fun thing to think about, but I doubt it will ever be implemented, as the execution needs to be done perfectly, and probably by a privately held SPV, for it to not trigger all the religious and political minefields that litter around and on it.

 

Having said that, if the government actually plans to do it properly and in line with the essence of the idea detailed here, and avoid most of the political and religious minefields,

 

I have no doubt we can do RM20bil in sales in the first year.

 

Disclaimers: Refer here.

 

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Website: www.choivocapital.com
Email: choivocapital@gmail.com

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  johnyeoyeo likes this.
 
probability Bring indians from India...they dont mind getting half the salary of malaysian and work double the hours...they are more knowledgeable and competent too..

Surely malaysian businesses will become more profitable
08/07/2019 5:30 PM
ks55 The first chief executive of Hong Kong, Tung Chee-wah, did the right thing with his housing policy in 1997, aiming for at least 85,000 flats a year in the public and private sectors, a home ownership rate of 70 per cent within 10 years, as well as a reduction in the average waiting time for public rental housing to three years.

However, he caved in under public opinion (from people already owned a property) and pressure from property tycoons like Li Ka-sheng and others to hold property price firm amid the Asian financial crisis. So the plan was shelved.

Otherwise, you will not see Hongkong coffin homes that need 2 generations to pay off the mortgage.

Malaysian govt should take this opportunity to let housing price fall to a more affordable level, without any dampening policy or subsidy.

Let the housing price find its own equilibrium, where supply and demand crosses.
Let those fly by night developers pack and go home.
Let the flippers go bankrupt.
AND let the fittest survive..............
08/07/2019 5:33 PM
probability So that the 1% rich can fatten their pocket further

As long as majority suckers are there...they can hv fun
08/07/2019 5:34 PM
ks55 https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/politics/article/2150463/no-hong-kong-housing-crisis-if-ex-leader-tung-chee-hwa-had
08/07/2019 5:34 PM
ks55 If we had followed reason instead of the masses ... today’s housing problem would have been resolved.

Statement by former chief executive Leung Chun-ying



BUT Govt of the day prepare to let Maybank lose money?
Is govt prepare to let developers close shop?
Is developer prepare to put up more low to medium cost housing like HDB flats?
9 millions willing buyers (from 26 to 38 yo) just waiting for a suitable house to call home. Is govt deaf? Are developers blind?
08/07/2019 5:49 PM
Sslee Dear ks55,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAKE_IMzT2s
Martin Jacques: Hong Kong is a typical colonial economy; it is not a competitive economy, it’s a monopolistic economy. It basically preferred or empowered the tycoons to run Hong Kong to divide up the spoils between themselves above all in the field of property where most of the money was made. So this is an oligopolistic and monopolistic economy.

Thank you
08/07/2019 6:09 PM
ks55 Simply there are too many people complaining houses are beyond reach.
Govt also like to say the same so as to put up PR1MA, Rumah Selangor Ku, and so on and so forth.

Is HDB flat expensive?
They are simply given for 'free' to all eligible!
Is private housing in Singapore cheap?
But there are still so many buying up as investment after they bought first HDB flat.

Singapore houses are not cheap, could be 5 to 10 times more expensive than Malaysia. But no one complain they could not get married because of housing problem!

AND NOW is Malaysian housing expensive?
Up to you to gauge yourself.
If you choose to buy a house with mortgage up to 30% of your household income, it is not expensive.
If you want to buy a house that take you 2 generations to pay off your mortgage, you are simply wearing hat too big for your head!

All in all, I would say it really depends on your mentality whether you are kiasu, or down to earth.......
08/07/2019 6:18 PM
stockraider THAT IS PRECISELY THE BUSINESS MODEL OF SINGAPORE, THEY BRING HIGH GRADE TALENT THAT CONTRIBUTE TO PROGRESS OF SINGAPORE LOH..!!

AS A RESULT SPORE ARE COMPETITIVE AS IT HAS UNLIMITED QUALITY INTERNATIONAL TALENT FROM CHINA, INDIA, EUROPE, USA , AUSTRALIA ETC AND CREATE TALENT QUALITY COMPETITIVE JOBS, COMPARE WITH MSIA THAT CREATE LOW SKILL PAYING JOB FOR BANGLA, NEPAL, BURMESE, INDON ETC LOH....!!

YES OPEN UP LIKE SPORE, IS ALSO THE BUSINESS MODEL FOR PROGRESS AND SUCCESS MAH...!!

Posted by probability > Jul 8, 2019 5:30 PM | Report Abuse

Bring indians from India...they dont mind getting half the salary of malaysian and work double the hours...they are more knowledgeable and competent too..

Surely malaysian businesses will become more profitable
08/07/2019 6:48 PM
stockraider U r out of point loh....!!

A local fellow want to buy a house should consider the advantage or cost & benefit of rent v buy mah...!!

Take for example a Double storey house in bandar utama, costing Rm 1m can be rented for Rm 2.3k per month, whereas if they buy it will cost Rm 7k a month and this is based on financing over 35 yrs loh..!!

Thus it is much better to rent Rm 2.3k per month instead of buying instalment Rm 7k per month loh...!!

Save up the diff , & u can buy insas to hedge against inflation n participate with economy growth loh...!!

The reason why it is chaper to rent is that the landlord is subsidizing your accomodation loh...!!

You need to be businesslike, when handling finance in a savvy way loh.!

Posted by i3lurker > Jul 8, 2019 6:58 PM | Report Abuse

stockraider already mentioned

rent

do not buy

KISAH BENAR EXAMPLE, GENUINE example Bangsar double storey house

MV = RM1.6 million to RM2 million

local family offers RM1,500 rental per month

Bangla offers RM2,500 rental per month

who you want to rent to?
of course Bangla lah, they stay 30 person per house that's problem belong them.

so RM2,500 X 12 = RM30,000 per year

= 30,000/2,000,000 = 1.5% yield per year...

of course stockraider says rent lah

bloody stupeed to buy is it not?

why buy? put FD better lah
08/07/2019 7:09 PM
probability aiyo raider..singapore citizens are like shareholder of the businesses set up there...they dont compete for wages with the foreigners..

they milk them!

olders citizens already have established assets...and their younger generation net worth is being enriched by reducing/maintained population..
08/07/2019 7:37 PM
probability i think malaysians (majority) will not be able to compete with even bangla..if given fair chance to compete...

dont let the malaysian become slave in their own country in the name of competitive business.. no harm raising wage at the expense on ROE...it does not reduce your competitiveness...as the majority business compete internally within Malaysia

malaysia have all the resources to ensure a wealthy nation...provided managed well and wealth is evenly distributed..

education, skills and competency is something the citizens definitely need to improve...but not at the expense of foreigners getting all the benefit they can get as a citizen
08/07/2019 7:45 PM
stockraider Cannot be like that loh....even Singapore msia supply alot of talent tho them mah......!!

Msia also export talent to USA, UK, China, Taiwan, Australia, Spore etc mah....This is bcos so msian are really good loh...!!

We should further develop them mah...!!

If msian cannot compete dieloh....some more u want to have high pay how leh ??

U cannot get high pay if u do not try hard loh...!!

So u need to be good , if no good develop ur skill lah...u think spore in 1965 very good meh ?? No better than msia mah....!!

But they are determine to improve mah....msia should be like that loh..!

Cannot compete is no excuse, need good attitude to learn how to do well loh.....!!


posted by probability > Jul 8, 2019 7:37 PM | Report Abuse

aiyo raider..singapore citizens are like shareholder of the businesses set up there...they dont compete for wages with the foreigners..

they milk them!

olders citizens already have established assets...and their younger generation net worth is being enriched by reducing/maintained population..


probability
10185 posts
Posted by probability > Jul 8, 2019 7:45 PM | Report Abuse

i think malaysians (majority) will not be able to compete with even bangla..if given fair chance to compete...

dont let the malaysian become slave in their own country in the name of competitive business.. no harm raising wage at the expense on ROE...it does not reduce your competitiveness...as the majority business compete internally within Malaysia

malaysia have all the resources to ensure a wealthy nation...provided managed well and wealth is evenly distributed..

education, skills and competency is something the citizens definitely need to improve...but not at the expense of foreigners getting all the benefit they can get as a citizen
08/07/2019 8:23 PM
probability aiyo raider...though i dont have the numbers with me...i can tell that the country's gdp per capita ratio to the average (majority population) wage earners's wage...would be having a steep difference...

the argument is more on what can be done to distribute the wealth..

all the natural resources money is going into a few crony pockets

this is not good for malaysia
08/07/2019 8:29 PM
stockraider I read the malay T10 numbers is even higher than the chinese T10 loh...!! This is bcos the govt benefit the elite Malay the most loh..!

If there is unequal distribution of wealth, they need to help their own people by giving training better and increasing their competitive attitude loh..!!

We cannot be simply increasing pay forever loh...!!

If u increase pay without increasing productivity means inflation will hit us loh....!!

This is what happen this few yrs, when everyone complain, that things all gone up price and higher cost of living loh...!!

Cost of living Up why leh ??
Govt Simply impose increase salary.
Corruption not under control.
Discrimination social engineering
Wastage, doing unnecessary things that does not generate productivity.
Giving Free monies; by giving free monies thru brim, subsidy etc loh...!!
Ringgit collapse bcos msia cannot compete loh....!!

So simply give more salary and freebies without much effort on the recipient or increasing productivity will make thing worse for the country loh....!!

ONE WAY PROBABILITY CAN DO TO IMPROVE WEALTH IS THAT, U DONATE PART OF YOUR WEALTH AWAY LOH...!!
But u think carefully lah...we have been doing that all this for a long time...bcos govt take ur monies but benefit the malay loh..!!

1. More university for the malay
2. More school for the malays.
3. Mosque and religious funding for malays

All these our children do not benefit but after 60 yrs of wealth transfer, their progress are still backward loh...!!

Posted by probability > Jul 8, 2019 8:29 PM | Report Abuse

aiyo raider...though i dont have the numbers with me...i can tell that the country's gdp per capita ratio to the average (majority population) wage earners's wage...would be having a steep difference...

the argument is more on what can be done to distribute the wealth..

all the natural resources money is going into a few crony pockets

this is not good for malaysia
08/07/2019 8:51 PM
stockraider Your suggestion does not help loh...!!
Make things worse loh...!!
Do not be emotional, i think u r frustrated loh...!!


Posted by i3lurker > Jul 8, 2019 8:54 PM | Report Abuse

Felda Settler Chef Wan says...……...

Quote “Back home, many of my fellow Felda settlers sell off fertiliser subsidies given to them by the Government, and when they receive dividends, they marry two or three times and ‘breed like cats’! unquote (from News Straits Times

wow!

I never knew that!! ..... They obviously need help!

Solution as follows:-
I propose that we now waive off all their outstanding loans from the Gobermen and hereby approve another RM1 million loan per head (babies included) interest free and convert to outright grant after 2 years.

Every Raya will have bonus too
08/07/2019 8:56 PM
7300 recession looming....150yrs deutche bank can see n started with asia,the deep cuts until to 2022 is no play play for next 15-20 years cycle huge ballons bust,
08/07/2019 11:43 PM
7300 not like US wolf, German are straightforward n sharp....mana soros?
08/07/2019 11:46 PM
stockraider Sochai u go n donate more money loh...!!

Talk very easy mah....!!

The non bumi have been donating so much money to the other races for past 60 yrs since independence loh...!!

But they need to buck up and improve for the greater good of msia, cannot always depend on handout loh....!!

U need to study better economics loh...!!

Posted by i3lurker > Jul 10, 2019 1:37 PM | Report Abuse

Problem with Malaysia is that people never studied economics and selfish racist people unwilling to give money to other races even though giving money to other races will help themselves.
10/07/2019 7:36 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In No no no need more people to work harder to contribute more to the country hahah
10/07/2019 7:39 PM
probability the capitalist like raider want you sochais to work hard for him ma...lol!
10/07/2019 7:40 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In it's okay can make back the money from his bad investments wakakaka
10/07/2019 7:50 PM
probability Humans have to learn from honey bees...the Queen (capitalist) and worker bees (wage earners)...lives together in a ~ fair society...they share their harvested honey together...independent to who brought more honey...they take care of their eggs, larva and pupa together...they know in which portions to share royal jelly with the queen..

obviously the queen bees knows to appreciate its worker bees..

they seem to know 'the balance'...

unlike human capitalists...that greedy ones ma....if they can get away with enslaving others ...they will....they dont mind squeezing the workers till their last drop of blood for their return on equity ma...

lol!
10/07/2019 7:50 PM
stockraider Simple question Raider ask probability loh ??

Are u willing to donate 20% of your wealth to these people and set aside lesser for your family members leh ??

Are u willing to pay 15% more in everything u buy compare with lesser this people pay leh ??

Are u willing to finance 50% increases in wages at the expenses of 20% increase of all good & service for all malaysian leh ??

Are u willing see continue wastages like building excess school,university, mosques , hospitals using all the tax payers monies that u and your children will never use bcos of its poor quality leh ??

If that is the case, it is not the time for all msian to be productive & work hard and make use of the limited resources efficiently mah..!!

If in order to improve the country, entail change of all msian people attitude & motivation, in order to be a go gather, do u not want to support this positive change leh ??

Thus simply increase pay without productivity is not the answer loh....!! U need to better the society 1st & not handout mah...!!

Posted by probability > Jul 10, 2019 7:40 PM | Report Abuse

the capitalist like raider want you sochais to work hard for him ma...lol!
10/07/2019 7:57 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In raider you trying to be racist here? No good
10/07/2019 7:59 PM
probability raider...we are not talking about donation here...i have no objections for workers to raise their competence level...

i am talking about giving 'pay' (A) fair to the 'cost of living' (B)...

remember B is actually where the business make their money...and its from business is where the A is formed...

A and B magnitude must be balanced...you cannot raise B and squeeze on A...

thats pure enslavery
....................

think about the maths above deeply...

i know the economics of money flow deeper than you can think
10/07/2019 8:04 PM
probability business make money B based on the populations basic consumption (cost of living)...

if you dont give them pay A...at the same magnitude level....you as business owner (capitalist) are basically siphoning their hardwork to your own benefit..
10/07/2019 8:07 PM
stockraider We are the victim & is still being discriminated...not racist loh..!!

Coming to minimum pay...a foreign bangla employee will cost an employer all in cost of rm 1600 per month inclusive of levy whereas the local will cost the employer about rm 1350 per month but why employer still willing pay more for the foreigner leh ??

This is bcos the foreigner are hardworking and has good working attitude whereas the local are soft, lazy and has bad work ethics loh...!!

One foreigner can do about 2.5 worker jobs loh...!!

Thats why raider say we must buck up loh....!!

It is not exploitation mah....!!

Posted by Mr Jho Heavenly Petron & GCB & ECONBHD > Jul 10, 2019 7:59 PM | Report Abuse

raider you trying to be racist here? No good
10/07/2019 8:08 PM
probability the subject we are discussing here (as far as i am concern) its none specific to malaysia or the inequality between races wealth distribution based on their hardwork or competence...

its about the general issue of the 99% poor everywhere..in the world

all their fucking hardwork right from the age of 5 till 26 and till they retire is siphoned by the capitalist (1%)...

their earnings will never catch up with the cost of living which their strive for all their life.....cost of living is a moving target ...and illusion..lured by the capitalist...which they will never attain...

they will never attain financial freedom they imagined they will
10/07/2019 8:14 PM
probability simply because as much as their pay is raised by the business they work for..their consumption cost is raised even higher..so that the business will make more money (from the net difference)....

this tension of stretch is inevitable..in a capitalist economy...but the tension can be relaxed if the capitalist cares...and if the worker demand a better pay..an lesser cost of living..

its a purely a mindset thing that can be cultivated ...if the workers act in unison
10/07/2019 8:18 PM
stockraider As raider say no use u simply give higher pay without productivity improvement mah...your barang price will also increase to compensate loh...!!

Take Australi chap fan will cost Rm 50 per plate compare to here Rm 7 per plate loh...do u want this to happen in msia leh ??

The other thing, if msian minimum pay is Rm 8000 month same as australia u think msia can compete with Thailand, Vietnam, Philipine, Indonesia & mynmar and sell n produce more than them leh ??

All these asean countries are quietly laughing at our stupidity to have such a high salary loh...!!

The business owner put their capital,entrepreneurial and management effort at risk, thus they need to be given fair return loh...!!

They can always move to another country loh...!!

The business owner is not exploiting, as they put in alot of tears, sweats and capital at risk try to promote & develop the country loh..!!

In addition they also paid alot of taxes mah...!!

Posted by probability > Jul 10, 2019 8:07 PM | Report Abuse

business make money B based on the populations basic consumption (cost of living)...

if you dont give them pay A...at the same magnitude level....you as business owner (capitalist) are basically siphoning their hardwork to your own benefit..
10/07/2019 8:22 PM
stockraider Why those workers do not build & create wealth leh ??

This is mainly, Bcos of poor financial management loh....!!
Imagine a worker can make Rm 7000 a month but they over spend Rm 8000 month........how to build wealth leh ??

U need to save & save mah...like make Rm 7000, u spendlah Rm 5000 a month loh..!!

This means need to downgrade your immediate standard of living in order to build capital mah....!!

To build wealth, the paramount importance is not actually how much u make but how much u save mah.....!!

If read rich dad v poor dad book, this is what happening to the whole world loh..!

In order to be successful u need to breakout from your poor dad mentality and join the rich dad mentality and change our attitude to live loh..!!

Posted by probability > Jul 10, 2019 8:14 PM | Report Abuse

the subject we are discussing here (as far as i am concern) its none specific to malaysia or the inequality between races wealth distribution based on their hardwork or competence...

its about the general issue of the 99% poor everywhere..in the world

all their fucking hardwork right from the age of 5 till 26 and till they retire is siphoned by the capitalist (1%)...

their earnings will never catch up with the cost of living which their strive for all their life.....cost of living is a moving target ...and illusion..lured by the capitalist...which they will never attain...

they will never attain financial freedom they imagined they will
10/07/2019 8:34 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In probability you should be the next Prime Minister really, I will vote for you. You have the exact same ideas as me, just that I can't put it in words as coherently as eloquently as you.

The fundamental source of the problem is greedy capitalists! Need so much money for what?
10/07/2019 8:40 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In I think one of the main reason for Malaysia employees to be unmotivated and can't work in a productive manner is because of the low wages. It's just like you work so hard but you still earn peanuts. Why not just go overseas to work, where you can earn more and can earn more in terms of purchasing power?
10/07/2019 8:41 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In stockraider please don't bullshit, Australia chap fan where got RM50? Spewing lies again. Full of lies and shit lah really !
10/07/2019 8:43 PM
stockraider Why bill gates, warren buffet, quek leng chan, robert kwok....not bcos they really want to just make alot of monies in which they already have more than enough, it is bcos monies look for them mah...!!

Success build success loh....!! This means they cannot help it loh....business just look for them mah...!!

These people donate alot of monies....but after donating alot....the monies again come looking for them loh...!!

One thing...u need to do something productive to breed success...u cannot sit down & shake leg, hoping u will be rich.

U need work hard, creative, skillful and rational b4 success look for u loh.....!!

In addition...if u earn monies....u must save up monies to create more productive capital mah...!!
10/07/2019 8:49 PM
stockraider after currency conversion about there loh...!!

Thats why alot of people cook ownself loh...!!

Posted by Mr Jho Heavenly Petron & GCB & ECONBHD > Jul 10, 2019 8:43 PM | Report Abuse

stockraider please don't bullshit, Australia chap fan where got RM50? Spewing lies again. Full of lies and shit lah really !
10/07/2019 8:50 PM
Zhen Wei Malaysia = low wages
10/07/2019 8:53 PM
stockraider Already explain why salary cannot be high loh...!!

The other thing, if msian minimum pay is Rm 8000 month same as australia u think msia can compete with Thailand, Vietnam, Philipine, Indonesia & mynmar and sell n produce more than them leh ??

All these asean countries are quietly laughing at our stupidity to have such a high salary loh...!!

It is all about productivity loh...!!

Posted by zhen wei & JP > Jul 10, 2019 8:53 PM | Report Abuse

Malaysia = low wages
10/07/2019 8:56 PM
Zhen Wei Demand> productivity > efficiency.
10/07/2019 9:06 PM
stockraider Remember if u go on the basis of high pay....the export industry will kaput and thus msia economy will kaput too loh...then one day ur grand daughter or great grand daughter may need work as a maid to spore, thailand, hk, vietnam to save and feed your family.

Just be very careful loh...!!
If u make the industry not competitive loh....!!

Posted by zhen wei & JP > Jul 10, 2019 9:06 PM | Report Abuse

Demand> productivity > efficiency.
10/07/2019 9:21 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In Why i see Singapore higher wage, but export industry no kaput, instead Malaysian need to go Singapore to become waiters (your perceived low class jobs btw). Why Australia with the highest minimum wage in the world doesn't have their export industry kaput? I think Malaysia is really a low wage country problem. Wawasan 2020 become high wage country leh, how high can it go I wonder, got 5 months left. Fresh graduates can barely get 3k (it's in Ringgit mind you!)
10/07/2019 10:24 PM
probability one can understand the views i had expressed above if you view the arguments in a closed loop economy (a single country where there is no export or import involved) where business exist interdependently within this economy to cater the needs of its citizens.

(you need not confuse by bringing cheap labor or competent workforce from foreign country into the equation)

within a closed loop economy, composite work done by all worforce = composite consumption of all workforce

competitive advantage of a worker (competence) would only make him deserve a salary relatively higher than less competent workers within the same country

the competent work force would enjoy consumption at the magnitude he earns..and thus deserving luxury items ( a bigger house , better car, better brand shoes, clothes and watches relatively)

this relative differential in competence would have at most extreme case be in the ratio of 40% very competent and 60% less competent..

it could never ever stretch to the observed 5% rich and 95% poor workforce to an extent that this 95% poor is unable to afford even the BASIC CONSUMPTION needs (an average house , an average car, education, children etc).....

despite these younger generation are inheriting cumulative workdone by their predecessor citizens

such an extreme stretch of maldistribution (unevenness) in consumption capability (consumption power) within the same country can only be done...caused by:

the bullying capitalist
........................
10/07/2019 10:49 PM
stockraider Correctloh...why spore leh ?

Singapore is the most competitive economy in the world mah....!!

They have skillful workers and make more high tech products, pharmauceutical, petroleum industry, there have great tourism industry with superb openness with various cultural of the world, there are hub connecting the world, then their education are superb quality loh...!!

The govt servant very small size and very efficient and most importantly they is not much corruption & wastage leh ??

If U compare to msia chehkai..youth define 30 or 40 also big arguement loh...also education very low standard, corruption high, wastages here & there....all the rich do not even use govt services such as university, secondary school, hospital etc bcos perceive very poor standard loh...!!

Again the people very backward talk about politic like race & religion and royalty to further divide the people. Alot of interference with free flow business even concert also cancel...the authority no brain loh...!!

Btw in spore u still can get Kai fan at SGD 2 to 3 whereas msia u get Rm 5 to Rm 8 loh...!! The inflation in spore not that high at all loh...!!

Yes salary is high, when u convert from SGD to MYR...but dollar to dollar...the price of basic necessity not expensive and cheap loh...!!

But car are extremely expensive alot of people do not own these assets loh..!! The public is taking bus and rail, which are super efficient & reasonable cheap mah...!!

The highest investment item for sporean is property...owning a HDB apartment is a commitment for a lifetime and consider very expensive n just like msia mah..!!

But in Msia u still can buy cheap cheap flat & apartment costing Rm 100k to Rm 300k, thus msia is cheaper.

Having say that Spore can afford to hava a minimum salary of Rm 6000 bcos they are highly efficient & most people work very hard loh..!!


Posted by Mr Jho Heavenly Petron & GCB & ECONBHD > Jul 10, 2019 10:24 PM | Report Abuse

Why i see Singapore higher wage, but export industry no kaput, instead Malaysian need to go Singapore to become waiters (your perceived low class jobs btw). Why Australia with the highest minimum wage in the world doesn't have their export industry kaput? I think Malaysia is really a low wage country problem. Wawasan 2020 become high wage country leh, how high can it go I wonder, got 5 months left. Fresh graduates can barely get 3k (it's in Ringgit mind you!)
10/07/2019 10:56 PM
stockraider I like to correct your wrong perception especially in msia loh....!!

Msia

1}T40 consist of about 15% of the population loh...!!

2) M40 consist of about 40% of the population mah..!!

3) b40 consist of about 45% of the population loh..!!

Where got 95% income control by 5% of the population leh ??

'it could never ever stretch to the observed 5% rich and 95% poor workforce to an extent that this 95% poor is unable to afford even the BASIC CONSUMPTION needs (an average house , an average car, education, children etc).....
despite these younger generation are inheriting cumulative workdone by their predecessor citizens

such an extreme stretch of maldistribution (unevenness) in consumption capability (consumption power) within the same country can only be done...caused by:
the bullying capitalist'!

THE MAIN REASON FOR YOUR WRONG IMPRESSION ARE DUE TO THE COMPLAIN BY THOSE GREEDY WHO WANT TO BE RICH BUT NOT PUTTING IN THE NECESSARY EFFORT?

Thus giving u a wrong impression that business owner is exploiting but in fact they do not.
The business owner put their capital,entrepreneurial and management effort at risk, thus they need to be given fair return loh...!!

They can always move to another country loh...!!

The business owner is not exploiting, as they put in alot of tears, sweats and capital at risk try to promote & develop the country loh..!!

In addition they also paid alot of taxes mah...!!


Posted by stockraider > Jul 10, 2019 8:34 PM | Report Abuse X

Why those workers do not build & create wealth leh ??

This is mainly, Bcos of poor financial management loh....!!
Imagine a worker can make Rm 7000 a month but they over spend Rm 8000 month........how to build wealth leh ??

U need to save & save mah...like make Rm 7000, u spendlah Rm 5000 a month loh..!!

This means need to downgrade your immediate standard of living in order to build capital mah....!!

To build wealth, the paramount importance is not actually how much u make but how much u save mah.....!!

If read rich dad v poor dad book, this is what happening to the whole world loh..!

In order to be successful u need to breakout from your poor dad mentality and join the rich dad mentality and change our attitude to live loh..!!
10/07/2019 11:13 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In You sure or not, you see the top management salary compared to those normal executives... Then you can clearly see the imbalanced distribution of wealth generation with regards to value creation of the employees already. You work 60 hours, I also work 60 hours, just because you worked longer or have better connections to get to the top then you deserve to be paid 100 times or even 1000 times more than a normal executive, this doesn't make a lot of sense to me. What I see is the wealth gap keeps on widening in Malaysia because of these greedy capitalist. That's not how a nation progresses, if you want to have advancement the government need to put in place policies that helps to narrow the wealth gap!
10/07/2019 11:25 PM
stockraider If u do donkey work surely u does not deserve high pay, compare with some other guy who huge value add to the the enormous wealth creation of the company mah...!!

Posted by Mr Jho Heavenly Petron & GCB & ECONBHD > Jul 10, 2019 11:25 PM | Report Abuse

You sure or not, you see the top management salary compared to those normal executives... Then you can clearly see the imbalanced distribution of wealth generation with regards to value creation of the employees already. You work 60 hours, I also work 60 hours, just because you worked longer or have better connections to get to the top then you deserve to be paid 100 times or even 1000 times more than a normal executive, this doesn't make a lot of sense to me. What I see is the wealth gap keeps on widening in Malaysia because of these greedy capitalist. That's not how a nation progresses, if you want to have advancement the government need to put in place policies that helps to narrow the wealth gap!
10/07/2019 11:41 PM
VSOLAR Sailang Margin All In then you are dead wrong, work in Australia do donkey jobs get paid $20/hour. In malaysia if you are a 'professional' can barely make RM10 per hour.
10/07/2019 11:45 PM
stockraider Thats why australia economy not robust, like singapore loh...!!
Bcos misallocation of resources loh...!!



Posted by Mr Jho Heavenly Petron & GCB & ECONBHD > Jul 10, 2019 11:45 PM | Report Abuse

then you are dead wrong, work in Australia do donkey jobs get paid $20/hour. In malaysia if you are a 'professional' can barely make RM10 per hour.
10/07/2019 11:48 PM
stockraider Remember if u work in australia, u can forget about of year end bonus and performance incentive loh...!!
U just rely on your fixed salary loh....!!

Bcos majority of the co think that, they have been over paying fixed overall salary to their staffs, thus bonus and performance incentive as reward is unheard of mah......!!

But not in spore & msia loh....!!
10/07/2019 11:54 PM
7300 another 3 yrs to down,2 years to sideway n 10 years to stabilised
14/07/2019 10:13 PM


 

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