Posted by idunwork > 2018-12-12 16:27 | Report Abuse

High cash position turned out to be correct this round LOL

Posted by Gen2 > 2018-12-14 17:36 | Report Abuse

Icap relies too heavily in Padini...

Posted by enigmatic > 2019-01-08 01:45 | Report Abuse

Latest NAV: RM3.19 (as at 2 Jan 2019)

Posted by calvintaneng > 2019-01-13 19:27 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by enigmatic > 2019-01-15 16:01 | Report Abuse

Latest NAV: RM3.22 (as at 11 Jan 2019)

Posted by joetay2 > 2019-01-15 16:01 | Report Abuse

a large part of icap's value is in padini, so i wonder how the nta is computed.

lol.............

Posted by value_man > 2019-01-16 09:12 | Report Abuse

NAV: 3.22
Share Price: 2.41
Discount: 25%

Posted by enigmatic > 2019-01-20 17:37 | Report Abuse

NAV per share as at 16 Jan 2019 was RM3.25

Posted by fong7 > 2019-01-29 10:16 | Report Abuse

Each year, TTB received huge profit coming from calculation by the fund's NAV, no matter how the iCap share price performed (unlike many world class company's style, which paying fees to their CEOs judged by the stock price performance).

Each year, iCap's investors watching their investment gaining (on paper) much lower than FD, not to mention Bursa index.

Isn't that sad?

Posted by fong7 > 2019-01-29 10:21 | Report Abuse

I can only say this, TTB is very untalented on investment. And Warran Buffett is genius.

Posted by fong7 > 2019-01-29 10:22 | Report Abuse

TTB has been timing the market, where Buffett has been finding gems in the market.

Posted by (S = Qr) Philip > 2019-01-30 22:09 | Report Abuse

Oh.my.god. and I thought pphb management was bad. At least PPHB takes 7 million in director fees every year but gives 15 million in net profit. This ttb takes so much in professional fees and didn't even deploy capital properly or invest.

Malu lah to compare with vanguard Jack bogle. At least his vanguard index fund charges 0.05% management fee every year.

Even Stockraider can do better.

Posted by qqq3 > 2019-01-31 03:05 | Report Abuse

TTB, fantastic theoretician, fantastic economist, but cannot execute. reminds me of somebody here.

Posted by stockraider > 2019-01-31 10:57 | Report Abuse

Usually u say yes bcos ur opportunity cost is generally cash with yield of about 4% pa, so ur opportunity cost is 5% to 6% pa mah...!!

As long as u buy with big margin of safety, usually u make monies above ur opportunity cost loh...!!

If u always say no....u will end up like Tan Teong Boo of icap in which 3iii and Philips are criticizing bcos of no balls to invest loh...!!

Posted by 3iii > Jan 29, 2019 01:35 PM | Report Abuse

The real challenge to prioritization is saying, “No!”

It’s easy to say yes.

What’s hard is saying no to busy work that gives you the satisfaction of checking an item off your to do list — meeting an obligation to someone else, doing an easy task, writing an email.

Posted by 4444 > 2019-01-31 22:30 | Report Abuse

NTA reduced why got profit?
https://klse.i3investor.com/servlets/stk/fin/5108.jsp

Posted by fong7 > 2019-02-04 21:06 | Report Abuse

profit comes from gain by selling stocks.
NTA comes from currently holding stocks' market value + cash.

Posted by cheoky > 2019-02-05 21:37 | Report Abuse

Holder of icap should vote out ttb. Real sad to watch holder of icap suffering

Posted by fong7 > 2019-02-22 07:01 | Report Abuse

i agree. shareholders should vote out ttb, he is not a good investor. He is a market timer and an extremely stubborn person, which defines a bad investor.

Posted by speakup > 2019-02-22 07:05 | Report Abuse

no more respek for ttb

Posted by enigmatic > 2019-02-23 12:31 | Report Abuse

What does TTB see in Parkson? Is he waiting to buyover the entire Parkson?

Posted by Parkson18 > 2019-02-23 12:40 | Report Abuse

After takeover Parkson, TTB merge with Padini?

Posted by (S = Qr) Philip > 2019-02-27 06:27 | Report Abuse

This quarterly report is so horrible, more revenue stuck, even more losses stuck. Everywhere you go parkson is empty, with expensive products which no one buys, except my wife when she gets all those free discount vouchers and gift cards from the banks and gas companies.

In all honesty, why is ttb not cutting losses and just move on, even in the face of a totally changing business horizon.

It's like that child which still tries to hold on to JC Penney because of memories. Is it because of he realizes the losses the total nta and ICAP shareholdings will drop like a rock?

Ttb wants to emulate Warren and Charlie. Buy the problem is he fails to realize they keep improving themselves and their mental models keep changing over and over. Warren moved on from cigar butt margin of safety concepts to Charlie mungers fair price for wonderful companies concept long time ago. Then Warren can improve to change his mind on airline stocks by buying 2 airlines. Then in 2016 on he started going big in TECH stocks. And today in 2019, Berkshire actually goes and buys a Brazilian IPO. Incredible! You can reach the 2 old men new tricks. They keep refining themselves and their investment philosophy as time passes, because the economic landscape keeps on changing.

TTB on the other hand, stuck with old n Warren buffet version 1.0.

Never improve, never innovate, sticks to level 1 thinking.

At least he gets paid well for sitting on money.

Warren and Charlie both gets paid 100k a year.

I think there is much to be said about the bias of directors who need their yearly salary as a means of survival. Then his needs and directions no longer align with the shareholders at large. If you get paid millions to sit on your ass as apposed to shareholders who only rely on dividends and share price growth, it's pretty embarrassing.

Posted by Sslee > 2019-02-27 08:04 | Report Abuse

Dear Philip,
Well said. We need more people to involve in shareholder activism.

Shareholder activism is not a privilege - it is a right and a responsibility. When we invest in a company, we own part of that company and we are partly responsible for how that company progresses. If we believe there is something going wrong with the company, then we, as shareholders, must become active and vocal- Mark Mobius.

A lot of people lose his life saving and some even commit suicide because of insider con job/scam. The con job/scammer get away with murder because good man do nothing until when the victim is his own family member or close friends then only they regret doing nothing.

“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” Edmund Burke. “To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men" - Abraham Lincoln

Thank you

Posted by fong7 > 2019-02-27 20:46 | Report Abuse

well said,
(S = Qr) Philip .

Posted by 3iii > 2019-02-27 21:19 | Report Abuse

>>>Is it because of he realizes the losses the total nta and ICAP shareholdings will drop like a rock? <<<


I think icap has already impaired this investment in Parkson already.

Posted by fong7 > 2019-02-28 06:32 | Report Abuse

TTB is a stubborn old man, who cannot admit himself of making mistakes (definitely unlike Warran Buffett). He doesn't sell Parkson, because he doesn't admit it's a mistake for holding Parkson for so many years blindly waiting for the business to turnaround. And TTB also doesn't admit he made a serious mistake of waiting for bear market to attack the world with huge damage. TTB waits for years and years, hoping his "bad dreams" to become reality, so that he could declare he won.

Oh, btw, he made others (the fund holders) to wait, not himself actually. As for him, he didn't wait a second for receiving millions of manager fees every year.

Posted by fong7 > 2019-02-28 06:33 | Report Abuse

I was wondering, the used to be famous "investors day" happened last year 2018, how's the crowd? Were there still people admiring him and attending that event? It's a joke now, for TTB to talk about investment, isn't it?

Posted by enigmatic > 2019-03-02 23:57 | Report Abuse

ICAP NAV as of 1.3.2019 stays at RM3.26

Posted by calvintaneng > 2019-03-02 23:59 | Report Abuse

Don't keep Icap you stunted stock anymore

Better sell & switch to OGSE stocks especially PENERGY now!

Posted by fong7 > 2019-03-04 07:30 | Report Abuse

ICAP has long become a value trap. Holding lots of cash that is unable to be realized in a very very very long time....how many 10 years you can wait? That's the key question if you are a ICAP fund holder.

Posted by fong7 > 2019-03-04 07:31 | Report Abuse

So NAV is now pointless number.

Posted by (S = Qr) Philip > 2019-03-04 07:57 | Report Abuse

Nett asset value needs to be in lockstep with revenue growth and earnings growth to mean anything, otherwise taking it in vacuum is really pointless. Tan teng boo fails to realize this. He is still stuck in Benjamin Graham cigar butt land, trying out 1950's investing when these days annual reports and quarterly reports can be read and analysed the same day it is released, globally. Even Berkshire has to change, investing in IPOs now (STNE), buying airplane stocks( delta etc), and even going big into tech stocks ( aapl). Why is tantengboo not evolving his mindset?

This year Warren buffet has dropped book value as measure of Berkshire quality, because of the new accounting method, and how a lot of his companies with poor(er) net asset value are giving out increasing earnings and revenue growth compared to his high net asset value ( utilities) which are producing poor results.

If at 90 Warren and Charlie can change their mental models, I worry for tan teng boo who is still stuck in his old mindsets of nav as margin of safety. What is safety?

Safety is knowing your stock and where the business is going.

Posted by mindful > 2019-03-04 11:27 | Report Abuse

Anybody would like to join me to attend the global investor week to get an additional 20% discount, please contact me at yeccapital@gmail.com. I am a shareholder. https://giw.icapital.biz/2019/

Posted by qqq3 > 2019-03-04 11:55 | Report Abuse

(S = Qr) Philip > Mar 4, 2019 07:57 AM | Report Abuse


If at 90 Warren and Charlie can change their mental models, I worry for tan teng boo who is still stuck in his old mindsets of nav as margin of safety. What is safety?
=======

margin of safety....the most misunderstood concept in investing....all because it is promoted by half past six teachers and soft cover investment books....and the love of novices................looks so logical...............

Posted by qqq3 > 2019-03-04 12:00 | Report Abuse

On the other hand, I must pity TTB.......

The accounts of icap will show little revenue if he does not sell his shares, and profits are based on dividends and trading profits...................investors look at the accounts will run away......price appreciations will be taken, not via P/L but directly to Reserves, hence never any profits even when NTA is increasing...........

so forever traded at discounts to NTA.

Posted by qqq3 > 2019-03-04 12:01 | Report Abuse

people have difficulty appreciating Icap........and will remain under performing ....forever.....

Posted by qqq3 > 2019-03-04 12:02 | Report Abuse

Icap invested $ 5 million in Padini and sitting on $ 100 million of unrealised profits.................every thing else they did for last 10 years is meaningless.

Posted by fong7 > 2019-03-05 02:33 | Report Abuse

does icap still holding the stupid bstead and parkson? I can't imagine any value investor who would be so bullish on these two. They are just....simply....rubbish stock.

Posted by fong7 > 2019-03-05 02:33 | Report Abuse

once again, (S = Qr) Philip, very well said. I can see you must be quite a good investor.

Posted by fong7 > 2019-03-05 09:34 | Report Abuse

waiting for London boys to fight TTB again....hope they do something, and able to gain support from minority shareholders....take down TTB from the board, reduce his fees, forced him to pay huge dividend if the fund continue to sit on cash doing nothing....and make strategic steps on how to reduce the gap of fund price discount to NAV.

Posted by qqq3 > 2019-03-05 22:14 | Report Abuse

Funds accounting.........unrealised profits/losses are taken directly to reserves, market good or bad is never reflected in the Profit and Loss Accounts.............Its a problem for all closed ended funds.

Posted by stockraider > 2019-03-05 22:19 | Report Abuse

The performance of the funds are measured by the increase of NAV, it does not matter P&L....bcos if warren buffet invest....he does not sell so not much profit to report....but his unrealised profit is huge loh...!!

Thats why fund should be measured by NAV growth & not P&L mah...!!

Posted by qqq3 > 2019-03-05 22:22 | Report Abuse

well.............the permanent huge discounts in Icap share suggest the investing public is not interested..........the discount is permanent, its not some thing u can arbitrage away.............

Posted by fong7 > 2019-03-06 00:01 | Report Abuse

stockraider, please tell us, do you think ICAP today is a value trap or a value "stock"? How many 10 years do we have? Reality bites.

Posted by stockraider > 2019-03-06 00:05 | Report Abuse

The only hope for icap....is vote for the dissolution as the expiry date is due soon mah.....!!

The olang putih is with us loh and TTB is like a pondan mah....that means a good chance we can liquidate the fund loh....!!

That means potential profit from close shop of icap loh.....!!

Posted by fong7 > Mar 6, 2019 12:01 AM | Report Abuse

stockraider, please tell us, do you think ICAP today is a value trap or a value "stock"? How many 10 years do we have? Reality bites.

Posted by enigmatic > 2019-03-06 00:51 | Report Abuse

oh come on, it's not all doom and gloom is it? ICAP's portfolio has done not too badly overall.

For shareowners holding for a long time & getting no returns, probably a time to let go some and invest elsewhere if you are done with TTB.

For newcomers, probably a low risk defensive stock that never sinks, unlike O&G, plantations, constructions, etc.

But I concur that TTB is running short on time. He should stop timing the market. In the event in 2025 that ICAP has a price range of around RM2.50-RM3.00 to its NTA while other stocks continue rising, it would spell the end of his base of supporters.

Posted by qqq3 > 2019-03-06 10:00 | Report Abuse

does that mean it get expiry at 2025?

Posted by (S = Qr) Philip > 2019-03-07 15:32 | Report Abuse

If you are just looking at nav, it went from 140 million to 498 million. Sounds good? If you average it out over 14 years since 2005 it is earning less than 10% per year. But you are a smallholder. So if you want to cash out today from ipo, you only get the share price increase ( no dividends, no nav) which for closed end funds is usually a discount to nav historically.

So as a smallholder you only get share price increase from rm1 to rm2.43.

For waiting 14 years.

You are getting like 6.8% compounded per year for holding on for 14 years.

Not exactly Warren buffet.

Posted by 3iii > 2019-03-07 15:36 | Report Abuse

ttb is supported in his icap funds by a loyal group of initial investors.

Those who invested over the last 10 years of his fund probably made very little gains.

Will these initial loyal investors remain in the fund in 2020 or will they vote for the dissolution of icap closed end fund?

Posted by 3iii > 2019-03-07 15:42 | Report Abuse

At inception of icap closed end fund, the hope was this fund could grow at 15% per year from 2005 to 2020. That is $1 capital invested will double every 5 years and in 15 years, will grow to $8.00.

It is unlikely that icap closed end fund can achieve a NAV value of $8.00 in 2020. The time is just too short for it to achieve this target.

At best, can icap closed end fund achieve a NAV of $4.00 in 2020? At least with NAV of $4.00 in 2020, it would have grown its NAV from 2005 at a compound annual rate of just slightly below 10%.