Ranking change
1 Kossan
2 Hartalega
3 Supermax
4. Top Glove


5354_

Previously Kossan belong to top 4 or no 4 gloves company. After Covid-19 pandemic, Kossan become top 2? Even previous taikor TopGlove cannot make profit yet.

Market take Msia glove industry as a whole. Wah lau .... each individual company is different ler. So Kossan must show good profits in subsequent quarters to prove that they are better glove company in Msia.

Hmmm ... I don't think so lor...

teknikal

Support 1.50 followed by 1.35.

Kanasai ... Supermax loss money affect Kossan meh?
THat;s why I said Kossan is better managed compare to all the glove companies.

We will see such high profit from Q to Q bcoz LHI is done with expansion. With lower capex, net profit can be high. Now is time to recuperate profit from their investment.

Supermax sleeping ka ? ZZZZZ
Where is QR?

Volume for today looks small for EPF or Abrdn to be involved.
Scenario may change after lunch.

Aik? ... EPF buy 700K units ...
Hmmm ... I think they are trading in and out. If net is buy price shld be up.
Hoping to buy at lower price I think.

Abrdn, EPF and Director selling. ... sigh... why ler?

THere's a reason Msia is top in gloves. I suspect is good Msia quality. China and Thailand took 5% was due to glove shortage during covid. They might come back for the same quality reason.

Ciak sai liao ... nevermind la ... wait for Q4.

yfchong

Taikor aberdeen cash out yor fuiyoh

Totally agree. Harta is valued more bcoz they pay better dividend than Kossan on historic basis. But I think Harta cannot sustain the same dividend payout anymore.

Harta outstanding shares: 3.417bill. Cash position: 1.6+ bill
Kossan outstanding shares: 2.557 bill. Cash position: 2+ bill

Harta production capacity been cut to almost Kossan level. Kossan made 2x net profit than Harta in Q3.

Either Kossan price go above Harta or Harta price drop below Kossan. This rely on sentiment.

Then have to wait next quarter result.

Never trust analysts. They have their own agenda.

EPF is buying. Lets see Kossan go up.

Supermax when release quarter result?

yfchong

Waiting for Supermax Q if sui can ride on

Flush out all that wanna sell. Just watch if Arbedeen and Kossan directors sell.

I think Kossan make a big mistake. Should announce some dividend. Small dividend also nevermind. Show some confidence.

Go and Google lor ...

Huangbk72

Got so high meh? When was that?

I see highest was 1.3 in 2012

Hmmm ... to see hor ... China had US Treasuries USD 3 trillion.
Now China has USD800mill of US Treasuries or Foreign reserves.
Can China loss money? Nevermind la hor. ... We see what happen.

Hahaha. .... ok ok .. You win. Long Live China. ..😂

Now we see if Kossan directors sell their shares in this good news.

To continue ... China quality lower. So if CHina improve on quality meaning increase raw material... their cost would be at par with Msia. Meaning they have to increase ASP to be profitable. So is China a big threat? ... maybe ... from lower labour cost.

To me ... China and Msia don't have much room to play when it comes to cost.

Sure. Capacity Utilisation is important. But that is from reported data. Everybody can see and make a decision. And from Kossan Q3 profit shows they managed their fixed cost well.

For me, to make money, we have to speculate future data, mainly demand and existing customers' stocks. If they need restock means gloves make money. From the improving gloves numbers, demand is back and customers' stock is lower.


Andre Kua

Actually do you know how to calculate whether or not glove is worth buying??? Based on QR??? LOL...

You have a rough estimate of their annual capacity. Use that to calculate based on guesstimate pricing for bulk 1000 pcs pricing. Then compare with their revenue and you will get a rough figure about ASP and if ASP is showing sign of rise. Use the base bulk pricing calculation of USD20-25/1000pcs to guess their current capacity utilisation.

Actually China also make NBR gloves. So their raw material cost is same as Msia.
But their quality is lower ... meaning thinner gloves. Meaning use lesser raw material.

Different usage. NBR for medical and high-end. Latex maybe food preparation or butchering facilities. Both has it's market. NBR more expensive lor.

Huangbk72

Right... Latex market is worse off.

Why TG never convert to NBR? No foresight?

Cannot compare Kossan and TopGlove.
TopGLove = Latex gloves ...
Kossan = 75% NBR Gloves, 25% latex gloves.

Anyway, my post shows that he is right ler ....

You are King of Pusing. Bullet can curve one... 😂

I know you are targeting Felix. But watch your bullets ler ... Don't simply tembak.
Anyway this Felix got problem one.
Enemy he tembak. Frens also he tembak .... hahaha

Huangbbkk72

You are right..

Felix is wrong

Hahhaha

You looking for an argument with me ah?
So here's the deal.

Andre Kua copy & paste for "For the 9 months ended 30 September 2023".
Meaning Q1+Q2+Q3 numbers
This for Gloves, TR etc ,,, meaning all the segments
Annual 2023: Q1 Loss Rm23.6m/ Q2 Loss Rm2.66m / Q3 Profit Rm41.8m
Add All quarters. Net loss Rm15.54. So if Q4 is profitable by more than Rm15.54... than it's in the black.

Felix999 copy & paste for "For the third quarter ended 30 September 2023,"
Meaning stand alone quarter of Q32023
Glove itself Profit before tax = RM31.21
"PBT was RM31.21 million in 3Q23 as compared with PBT of RM1.00 million in 3Q22" is from the report .... MEaning glove shows high improvement.

You know how to read report boh?


Huangbbkk72

Sore loser ya..

Today Andre and Chipee posted ya. Not theedge

Look up

Ok la got improvement.
Q2/23 Gloves loss was 46.98m
Q3/23 Gloves loss was 15.77m (improve by 66%)
Q4/23 ???



Andre Kua

Reading all the comments make you be like Ahmad Mazlan (binggung) when you actually load up the QR report.

Kossan actually made a loss on their gloves... negative 15millions from glove but clean room gain 6.7m... overall glove segment still losing 8m++ compared to Harta who is turning a small profit. What boost their profits is the Technical Rubber segment and OTHERS (which they indicate is related to investment holding etc).

I see Rm1.85 resistance.

Kossan has Rm2bill. Rm1.2 bill in cash. Rm800mill in liquid investment (FD maybe)

Yeah man. after covid, I value kossan more than harta.
Kossan shld be more than Harta share price. Both produce nbr gloves. Unlike TopGlove with latex gloves.

klee

harta only 27.7 mil profit

PROFIT .... RM41.8 million. WooHooo !!!!!

Riverstone has annual capacity of 15 billion. Meaning they are smaller. Fixed cost is lower. Of coz their Net profit is good. But only at this transition moment. But they can't take the advantage when demand spikes. It's gloves we are talking about. Nothing high end. Glove is a volume game.

Sigh .... DEPRECIATION include buildings la ..aiyoh... Only land doesn't have depreciation.

Felix888999

Aiyoh I'm not accounting people leh. Read PL, BS and cash flow boleh lah. Accounting technical things wau mana tahu.

U find out and give us answer lor.

Felix888

Machines depreciation useful life maybe just 5 years. How about factory building?

If got impairment loss like Harta, it would had been reported in financials. No report means no losses lor. Moreso, 14 & 19 years ... DEPRECIATION already recorded over the years. Those plants should ALREADY recorded "losses" in those years.

Must look at their distribution channel too. They are big meaning they have the means to push to volume when demands recover. Riverstone ... I don't know la.

UlarSawa

Riverstone is better. At least until now no red QR before even pandemic over leh. See their QR you must even envy them still can give divvy leh. Taikor is the worst leh. Over expanding until beyond control need to cut capacity leh. Alot of white elephant statues on display on the factory leh. Kesian. Haiyoh. Correct?

Harta cut down close to 13 billion pcs per year. Kossan only reduce 3 biliion pcs.

I don't think they have impairment loss bcoz they didn't decommission. They improve their machine and process to increase productivity. Line will still jalan after improvement. Unlike Harta, terus shutdown.

2020 data on production capacity
TopGLove 86.4 billion pcs
Hartalega 40.5 billion pcs
Kossan 32 billion pcs
Supermax 26.2 billion pcs

So Kossan & Supermax is in the sweet spot in production size for current demand. TopGlove and Harta got higher production capability means their fixed cost is high.
Harta shutdown Bestari Jaya is cut down 32% of production capacity = 27.5bill.... So Kossan is still within the range of safe play in production size.

Wah lau ... drag to next week liao this QR result. ...sigh ... why ler?

Now between the 4 taikors, I look at cost side. TopGlove to big liao. Fixed cost very high.
Medium size like Kossan still can survive.

Machine la. Raw material la ... all the same. China and Msia.
China glove quality is lesser. Only reason, their gloves are thinner. Thinner gloves mean lesser raw material.

Only difference is labour cost. China labour cost is cheaper than Msia I think.
Some more, Msia policy now foreign workers frenly. Must pay minimum wage la, give good accomodation la ... wahlau ...sure high cost lor.

Only thing can save Msia gloves is US fight with China. Ban their product or higher tariff.

Damn ... no dividend was announced by Hartalega but they had share buy back.
I wonder if Kossan be the same ... sigh.

Usually early Nov.
ChandranG

@Chipee. Q3 out this month?

Whole market is down. So can't blame it. Wait for Q3 to announce.

ChandranG

Down back today 😅 so fluatuate

Yeah ... damn kanciong ... hahaha

Likesung

Chipee
Qr need to wait this end of October