Are you implying yinson is going bankrupt and expenses more than revenue?wow... Why Abu dabhi funds yinson production with 1 billion usd when other fpso suppliers all have difficulty getting long term funds from banks?

How come yinson bonds rated A and all their bonds taken up?

Only johnchew know yinson is bad...

How much jaks are you holding mike?

How come jaks is a penny stock while mfcb and yinson with billions? Everyone is blind except for John chew

Maybe if you write enough stories they can divert funds to jaks instead,

Johnchew have you written to them and share your findings? Why would they sign up to a fake company that has increase its share price by 50x in 15 years?

and please tell me why crazy funds will pump 1.5 billion into yinson if details so bad ?

I'm confused, funds silly to punt 1.5 billion usd at 7% cash and 6% in kind with no escape clause except ipo?

So yinson still maintain control and they get to cheat professional fund managers from 3 big firms?

jjohnchew

Hoho KonLee what do you think :

1.) Current Ratio 0.64 is oredi Low : working capital can Last for 7 months only .

>>>>>>
What is working capital after 1 billion influx how many more month can survive?

johnchew, if you understand debt profile, do put in proper figures and facts.
Notably, Yinson has outstanding perpetual bonds amounting to RM1.3 billion. These include a five-year, 7.5% RM360 million sukuk with its first call date in the fourth quarter of 2027 (4Q2027), and a 15-year, 6.8% RM950 million sukuk, callable in May 2033.
https://www.marc.com.my/rating-announcements/marc-ratings-affirms-ratings-on-yinsons-programmes/
yes debt profile will hit 22 billion until agogo starts to sail this year. but after that collection of charter rates and repayments will be highly consistent

you just posted above that yinson order book is 94 billion lasting until 2048 (23 years) but your total yearly revenue is 3976 million a year. meaning in your calculation yinson revenue is only 92 billion over 23 years. correct?
then you put 10% interest expenses or 1.8 billion a year. is the debt profile fixed rate or reducing rate, meaning has yinson ever refinanced debt?

Notably, Yinson has outstanding perpetual bonds amounting to RM1.3 billion. These include a five-year, 7.5% RM360 million sukuk with its first call date in the fourth quarter of 2027 (4Q2027), and a 15-year, 6.8% RM950 million sukuk, callable in May 2033.

It redeemed US$120 million (about RM567 million) worth of its outstanding perpetual bonds this month. These perpetual bonds were issued in March-April 2019, with a coupon rate of 8.1%.

Yinson, which has a charter order book for nine floating offshore vessels, also raised RM238 million through a private placement of 3.96% of its enlarged share capital this year.


then you posted total loans to be paid in 10 years is 2 billion a year, or 20 billion in 10 years. but their loans are non recourse and many are bonds raised by the units themselves which are tied to FPSO and not to mother
>>>>>
Posted by jjohnchew > 15 minutes ago | Report Abuse

👉 Yearly Revenue USD 883.56 million x 4.5 = RM 3976 million / year .

Administrative Expenses RM 185 m x 4 = RM 740 m / year …

QR October 2024 Total Loans n Borrowings RM 19.37 billion >> interest expenses x 0.09 = RM 1743.3 million/ year .


>>> : As 60 % of Term Loans per QR January 2024 is maturity between 2 to 5 years..

👉Total Loans to be paid in 10 years = RM 1937 million/ year

Total expenses ( excluded Hedge , SBB ) / year = RM 4,420.3 million


👉👉 Total Expenses / year - Total Gross Profit / year = RM 1310 million , ie : SHORT of Expenses Fund RM 1310 million.

if you borrow 1.2 billion and get back 5.3 billion in 15 years... AND you own the FPSO ready for new commissioning... do you know the IRR returns?

And if you question is if FPSO contract is canceled how? then you can see yinson history how many deployed and how many canceled.. fyi the only one canceled is due to force majere due to china and vietnam worries and even that they are paid counterparty risk and the ship is fully paid for for them to deploy to malaysian waters. fyi they get to keep all the initial payments settlement
>>>>
Maria loans = USD 0.758 billion = RM 3.4 billion—- charter rate USD 5.3 billion.

👉👉👉 Why so desperate on FPSO Agogo … Higher loans but with Low charter rate :

fyi this deal is also proof that Yinson should already have the FPSO contract in hand, and ready to pounce and is only planning to announce after they get the finances to secure the deal, which is also something to take a look at. Once agogo is deployed all the big risks are mitigated and they can begin to continue with the new projects that they have won.

FYI in 2023 they already had mezzanine bonds at 12.95- 13.25% rate from institutions. So this is much easier on the eyes

>>>>>
I thought Bond 9.625% is oredi very bad, now RCPS with 12.95%- 13.5% coupon rate....omg...

Anyway for existing Yinson shareholders no worries...u hv beautiful profit projections in yr sweet dreams...

And 2 cents div in real life

Importantly to also ask who has the ability to bid for contracts and have the money and funds to execute? With bare boat charter rates at 600k per day rate and long term contracts, the market is very favorable to fpso suppliers.

More importantly to look at is to ask the questions is debt non recourse? If it is then you know the limits of liabilities is more controlled and accepted by the lenders

Good way of looking at it in my opinion is also very simple, if Malaysian market don't want to support, Europe international market willing to support and I can get projects that cost 1 billion but bring in 4 billion, then the irr is 18% then things are cheap as my lending costs are lower.
>>>>>>>

I have a USD1.3b contract. I need USD300m equity and borrow USD1b to fund the project.

I dont have the USD300m now, what do i do?

1) Dont do, sit there and wait, collect money from current projects. But then, what does you project team/suppliers who did the huge projects with you do if there is no jobs?
2) Right issues, but your shareholders will hate it.
3) Do placement, but your share price is not at a level where you want to dilute yourself more.
4) Do rcps/mezz, banks are ok but rate is 13%.

With this RCPS, they can effectively do another 3-4 USD1.5bn jobs without raising any equity.

13% seems high, but raising money from right issue is also risky and opportunity cost of for equity is around there. And in this rcps, they can actually just defer everything and dotn pay cash if they dont want to.

Now mikecyc or johnchew or whatever banned is you have, please click my profile look at my portfolio see my yinson exposure and click on my telegram link in my profile to debate me more on telegram properly. Let old man here teach you how to invest in palantir Nvidia harta and ql and yinson with documented accounts of how I held palantir and Nvidia in 2022 and yinson since 2011.

Once you learn to grow up time to talk less and learn how to invest.

Fyi I don't have to charge fees like otb to make my money or charge le group fees like you young kids.

If I can take money from bursa and NYSE why do I even need to charge fees?

You know why they invest in yinson? Very simple, fpso armada kraken cost 1.5 billion to build. Fpso Atlanta cost 478 million to build.

Now go search your facts and figures and tell me how many barrels per day production they each can product and tell me the LTV per fpso returns on production over the contract period. Oh yes kraken contract to be terminated and renegotiated on a yearly basis as signed by armada. Why they sign such silly contracts I don't know

John chew why don't you start spam emailing Abu Dhabi Investment Authority (ADIA), and funds managed by British Columbia Investment Management Corporation (BCI), and RRJ Group (RRJ), and tell them the hidden risks of investing in yinson.... They are putting 4.5 billion ringgit to yinson investment to grow more with another 2 more billion by next year should they win the other 2 FPSO tender coming up. With a fleet of 15 FPSO targeted using china construction and international charter rates with incredible up front cash payment or ship payment for conversion total cost to yinson versus market peers is incredible as they are not greedy like armada and Sapura ( their rates are bare charter and not tied to oil price or production guarantees) and they are smart enough to get enough financing to complete majority of projects ahead of schedule. 4months ahead of schedule in fact.

So johnchew, any more comments on your fact and figures? Tell me if you have 1.5 billion usd why I would put into yinson?

Talk less doesn't mean no brain.in fact talk too much actually show your brain. Why are people banning you so much while I have never been banned before

This John chew talk so much meanwhile others making money hand over fist in yinson and jtiasa. How much jaks shares you currently hold? Fyi despite your facts and figures you have no reason to explain fact and figures why funds pumping another 1.5 billion into debt ridden yinson despite them saying their are not reducing debt but using it to grow even more. So lucky they are not reading your anal-yst insight into yinson. Mike you are worse than bank sell side analyst. You look for any flaws to justify your small minded brain that someone is out to get you and worse, you keep repeating like a broken record. Meanwhile the rest of people like lee is making money in jtiasa. I suggest that until you start making money in bursa to refrain from making a fool of yourself

Bursavulture preferred shares I think their offer comes with higher div and warrants with conversion within long time period I think for additional 500m usd

mikecyc/johnchew how many shares of jaks are you holding currently?

Now, ask yourself why Jaks which has zero experience building power plant suddenly jump into such a huge contract without any money and capability? That's why you lose money in Jaks mike. That's why...

*for some reason fpso kraken cost 1.4 billion to build. Why fpso Atlanta only cost 465 million to build? One built in China using cheap ship, the other built in keppel shipyard using conversation of sueznax which was bought at a very very expensive price back in 2013 during the oil craze. That is called proper management of funds

That's why I say those who don't look at contracts and only look at top level will only lose money in Jaks while those who spend extra to look at the numbers actually make money ( like those who buy yinson).

Here are the numbers kid mikecyc.

Why armada is worth so little.
They signed 1.5 billion contract for 8 years firm for 1.4 billion and 17 yearly option extensions. But when fpso kraken production drop by 60%, long term value of kraken is gone which is why armada is not worth money because the contracts are loop sided to owner instead of builder. At this rate kraken bare boat charter will end next year with no profit after 8 years of hardship.

Yinson on the other hand sign 15 year firm with 5 year option o&m for 2 billion, with the construction cost 465 million. So in this case they built it cheap, with long term FIRM 15 year contract.

Now you know why yinson 8.6b, armada 3.9b. do you know why Jaks is worth 360 million?
>>>>>>

ours ago



jjohnchew

Hoho ho ho ho the Serba Story Teller Buy what u Not Understand why so madd n childish like in Jtiasa as u said Not holding any Jtiasa shares …

Meanwhile, Hong Leong Investment Bank (HLIB) Research estimates that the Kraken FPSO has a daily charter rate of approximately USD480k/day (or USD175m/year), which accounts for some 35% of the group's revenue contribution in FY2022.


Fpso Atlanta usd 305,000 a day ( first oil 31 dec 2024 )

Just because you throw enough mud and hope everything will stick doesn't mean it will.

You realize the difference of contract between Atlanta and kraken right? Or you think it is the same contractual and return rate between both types. One was signed at 2013 when oil price was sky high and people were offering crazy offers because they thought oil prices were going to go higher while the other was signed in 2021 when yinson was one of 2 bidders... Guess who can offer better rates?

This reply alone makes me wonder what this little kid is thinking about... no wonder he thinks jaks is an amazing business and everything else is bad... jtiasa is bad, yinson is bad... but contrast to value yinson is 8.6billion, jtiasa i 1.2 billion, meanwhile his very highly reported and believed stock jaks is... 350 million and dropping... so why do you still bother to post when your "facts" and "figures" basics are already so wrong?

>>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho after financial assets minus financial liabilities recorded at that QR ..then is on the interest rate / interest expenses for simplified …

Please tell more stories and make up more things. But do you dare take this bet?
Next quarter yinson earnings from maria quitera and Atlanta will be much much more than this quarter and more quarters to come. Do you dare take this bet?

If you lose please stay out of yinson thread forever. If you win I will apologize profusely to you and say you are hero investor.

Do you dare?

So storyteller, tell me when your Jaks will pay out the dividend, which date will it do it and how it will actually pay the dividend ya?
Do you have any date for their dividend? Don't have? Why don't have? Running a scam to push dividend to next next year maybe so they can push share price up. Or transfer money to alp.

>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho No worries.. Jaks started give out Dividend after 10 years .. is DY

Only kids with no proficiency in investing actually look good at Jaks even after losing so much money

What revenue loss? The contract only starts after first oil. How to lose money if the contract only starts when oil is found

Lucky more first oil no more repeating first oil nonsense

Next kids will complain why yinson give out dividends.

>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho why Yinson keep SBB le ?

name dropping is useless when you are big into jaks while someone else buying hartalega and making money with dividends now

>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho ssleee i am name dropping again lo … nowadays only use this name :

👉 Hoho I am posted Top Glove TP RM 3.40 on 4/12/2020 , ard 2 weeks earlier than JPM TP RM 3.50 .. 
 




And posted the study on Nitrile Gloves Demand vs Supply of 7 Local Gloves company on August 2020 that Supply Shl fulfilled Demand in 12 months…

Do you think yinson production payment is in USD or MYR?
>>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho another risk on Forex : USD to RM from 4.71 to 4.48 … affect the Profit / Loss …

Are you serious??? This is what you call risk? It's only risky to those who don't know how to read reports

>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho another risk is on Financial Reports is Not followed IFRS , said shl follow IFRS by next FY , ie FY26 … from Operating Lease to Finance Lease … make sure backtrack the Elimination amount is Correct le ….

3 hours ago

You keep shifting goal post from first oil la to IFRS la to this and that la. What is real is dividend, earnings, share buyback, and project handover. Talk so much, first thing is to learn how to see cash and earnings and gestation period. You want to bet that next quarter in February will yinson earnings go up or down?

>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho as posted earlier:

Oh now for you do share buyback with own cash also become wrong thing.... Like that everything you want to be wrong can be wrong. In your eyes everything can twist twist.

I wonder if your bank account and stock portfolio can be twist twist also? In the end your back account number won't change... If don't know how to buy stocks buy what also no use

Mikecyc you wanted first oil?

https://www.yinson.com/highlights/YP-FPSO-Atlanta-achieves-first-oil/

So, anything more to say...

This type of comment is so silly I don't even want to start commenting to repair the misstatement. Tak malu make such comments without actually reading properly first?
>>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho Yinson working Capital is only Last for 7 months … need to Refinancing ke like sold FPSO Anna Nery 11.8 % equity :

Where as Jaks working Capital is always can Last for 12 months : Current Ratio 1.04

More importantly unlike Jaks, their funds and cash level are locked to FPSO debt repayments and cannot be used for anything other than that. That's why their Fitch bond rating is BA1. Jaks can't even borrow money internationally.

>>>>>>
Sslee

Yinson AS AT AS AT
31.10.2024 31.1.2024
Unaudited Audited
RM million RM million
Current assets: 5,262 4,782
Current liabilities:3,350 4,575
Know what that donkey talk about current ratio and Yinson working Capital is only Last for 7 months … ???

The difference between level 1 investor and level 2 investor. One talk a lot and never make money, one just makes money and listens to others talk.

>>>>>
BursaVulture

@jjohnchew

Reducing the Anna Nery stake was part of the agreement when they invited the Japanese investor long long long time ago. It was all according to agreement and plan, not a last minute decision.

So funny guy now we have first oil which means Nov dec Jan qr will have contribution from maria quitera and Atlanta. Anything more to say?
600 million cost to generate 1.98 billion over 15 years with 3 years construction period. Since you obviously know nothing about power plant construction judging from your investment in Jaks, you will finally learn why I make money with yinson while you lose money with Jake.

>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho why working Capital / Current Ratio is still Not Improving after 2 times Refinancing ???

Yinson Production lists FPSO Anna Nery project bond on the London Stock Exchange
18 Jun 2024 — Yinson Production marked the successful listing of the USD 1.035 billion senior secured project bond for FPSO Anna Nery on the International ...


Refinancing on October 2024 sold 11.8 % equity of FPSO Anna Nery … ownership is reduced from 75 % to 63.2 % !😱

22/10/2024 : K Line own 11.8 % with USD 49 million.

Talk so much nonsense dare to put your money where your mouth is? Or just like to troll without substance?

Date to take the bet?

John chew, are you willing to take a very that next quarter earnings and revenue will be more than this current quarter? If you dare take that bet, if you win I will praise you and be quiet and let you say whatever you want, if I win you be quiet and leave jtiasa thread forever?

Do you dare take this bet?

I very much agree on this, the gestation period is 4:1, which means their 20 year contracts yinson will only break even in 4 years, according to the contracts. The risk is almost cleared with fpso now deployed and working (maria quitera, atlanta and now waiting for the last on e agogo). But the true value of yinson will only emerge and debts cleared out only 5 years after the fpso hits first oil (as their contracts are day rate charter).

I do hope they will start to slow down and pare off debt, but also am worried as their incoming CFO and CEO are both young and very ambitious young men with big dreams. i think worth to jump in and gamble, but in the end still very agressive indeed. we will see next year after the warrants end, and they can increase debt retiring and payments



MiaoMiao7

the question is will they continue to load up with debts or will they take a break? lim kept saying this has never been a good time for fpso co, and we all know what happened to the greedy dog crossing the river. just because it is a good time doesn't mean loading up more debt is a good idea. yinson needs to take a break

In the latest quarter you have 1c dividends and 100 million in share buyback. In my opinion as they are keeping almost 3 billion in cash to offset the long term loans, and since they are in a growth stage where next quarter they should be receiving almost 300+ million in earnings from fpso operations with another fpso coming online next year, I think the wait is frustrating and fully justified for investors.
For me since I like long term investments, this is something online with my investment philosophies so I'm more than happy holding

That is probably because using eps as a guide is not very accurate. Their basic business model is they don't get paid until the fpso produces oil, although in same cases they are paid in advance for the construction of fpso. So the main idea is over the ships are sent to site and hits first oil is when it actually starts producing income. Similar to a power plant utility business, no real income until plant are operational. Currently now only maria quitera first oil which was in October 15th, so will only be reflected next quarter earnings. And Atlanta which is targeted for December first oil, which will also only be reflected in next next quarter earnings. Until then, what we are looking for is a reduction in epcc revenue as only left one more FPSO which is ahead of schedule and expected to hit first oil in 4th quarter 2025.
>>>>>
Robert Waters

So much good news about this company on the forum and from all the analysts ... yet figures contradict their statements. Recent numbers:
_______________________________________________________
EPS: RM0.062 (down from RM0.073 in 3Q 2024).
Revenue: RM1.85b (down 34% from 3Q 2024).
Net income: RM200.0m (down 6.1% from 3Q 2024).

Neither do you,

>>>>>
jjohnchew

Hoho a “ Failed “ Serba Story Teller Buy What u Not Understand even in Account Fraud… why so “ Gan Cheong “ if u don’t hold any Jtiasa shares…

Mikecyc why talk and repost so much but don't dare to share when you bought your Jaks and how long you holding it and your total amount? Scared to show you inability to invest?

Haha sslee I remember once upon a time you challenged my to show my QL holdings online, which I did and show that I'm still holding as overpriced QL more than doubled in value over the 5 period with even more growth in the offing. Not you know how it feels.

Yes I've shown my last 6 year portfolio online, and lee just showed his underpants in this thread. So when is it your turn to put up or shit up.

Hour much Jaks are you holding?