Well Shirley1, to those victims no one put a gun at their head to force them to buy. The only thing to do now is to brace themselves for the consequences. In fact, the victims' rage should be directed to the GM2 operators and all their lying con-sultants!

Folks, if people do not learn from history, they will repeat history & therefore will become HISTORY(Bestino+Samudra JV+GM1+GM2=Greed)!!.....Hahahahahahahah!!

As such it's going to hurt them for the rest of their lives. An expensive lesson learned indeed!!.......Wakakakakakakakak!!

Even if Genneva ride out of this storm, I bet most of the so call "investors" (but you can't call them investors cause its not an investment company, its a trading company, more likely I label them as punters), will get out of it as soon as possible.

In Ponzi scheme, if all layers trying to get out, it disastrous. Ask youself folks, you think Genneva has the cash to buy back all gold?

I bet even if 20% of their "punters" want to sell back the gold, they will go bust. Hahahahahahahahahah!!

I am very happy BNM took this action not because I am jealous that these fools are making tons of returns a month, it because it protrays human psychology in GREED, FEAR & SELF DECEPTION!

Serve them right!! Hahahahahahahahah!!

Part 5

How about Case B, where Bob cannot get anyone to lend him money?

Well, his situation is then that he has 27,84k in his pocket, and he's completely at the mercy of Al-Rajhi bank! I have no idea what happens in the case of default in this scenario, I need an expert in Islamic Banking Syariah law to explain this scenario to me.

But as far as I know, AR is still holding onto the gold, and therefore they are still charging him 15,680 per month as protection money, so AFAIK, Bob goes bankrupt in 2 months...

And don't get me started on the people who didn't have RM1m in the first place, like Bob above (Part 2).

I've heard of plenty of people who took out loans to buy their initial "investment" in the first place... those people are now in EVEN WORSE TROUBLE than Bob in scenario B... they are ALREADY bankrupt, and have loan payments that they CANNOT MEET.

Makes the 20%-30% losses described in the newspaper look absolutely pleasant by comparison, doesn't it?

.....The End....from The Angry Investor

There you are folks! Anyone here in this type of scenario? Care to share? Heheheheheh!!

Part 4

BUT

If Genneva does not honor the agreement? For example, if the company ceased operations? Bob's status BEFORE HE GOES TO REDEEM HIS GOLD FROM AR is:

Rm216k - (15.68k x 12 he has had to pay AR the monthly interest/ protection fee still!)

= 27.84k in his pocket!

And now, there are 2 possibilities at this point, actually. Cause in case you didn't notice, Bob only has RM27.84k in his pocket, and his debt is RM1176k. He can't get back his collateral unless he finds someone to lend him the money to get back his collateral!

Case A, someone lends the money to Bob:
Bob redeems his loan, get's back his gold.
Bob now has 27.84k in his pocket, RM1.176k debt to whoever gave him this new loan, and he has RM1.568k worth of gold.
He now has to figure out what to do with that gold!

If he manages to sell it for RM1.568k, his situation is not so bad.... that means that after squaring his debt, he now has 1568-1176+27.84= 419.84k. This is a pretty bad drop, from RM1m, but Bob can still survive it.

However, if gold price has dropped, OR if he can only sell his gold for a lower price (VERY likely, gold shops and banks and other people who buy gold will take their share of the profit), Bob will lose even more. If he loses 10% when selling the gold, he now has 263k. If he loses 20%, he only has RM106k. Bob is now looking at some VERY serious lifestyle changes if he lost 90% of his savings.

......cont Part 5

Part 3

So Bob follows his agent's advice and further "leverages" himself. He goes to Genneva, gives them 600k, and gets back 480k worth of gold. He goes to Al-Rajhi (AR) and gives gold, gets 360k.

Current Status:
360k in pocket, 960k debt, 1280k gold held as collateral (gc) and an option to sell the gold back (goldoption) for RM1.6m.
Income stream 32k Genneva, -12.8k Al Rajhi.

He does it again.
-RM360k, + 288k gold.
-288k gold, + RM216k.

Status:
RM216 pocket, RM1.176m debt, 1.568m gc, goldoption 1.96m.
Income 39.8k Genneva, -15.68k AR

Let's stop here even though this could continue a few more rounds.

Anyhow, *IF* Genneva honors the agreement, at the end of 1 year, Bob redeems everything, and his status is now:
1.960m (since he sells the gold, the 1.568m no longer comes into play)+216k-1176k +(39.8k x 12) - (15.68k x 12)
=RM 1m (his initial bank account) +477.6k -188.16k(the income streams)
=RM 1,289,440.

Bob makes a nice 29% profit in one year! He is happy!

........cont Part 4

Part 2

Example: Bob starts with RM1,000,000.
He goes to Genneva, pays RM1m, gets 800k worth of gold. Genneva promises him an income stream of 2% ie RM20k per month. They promise to buy the gold back at RM1m upon maturity.

NOW, under his agent's advice, he goes to Al-Rajhi bank and gets an "Islamic loan", which is similiar to a normal loan but with worse terms. Basically, they take the 800k worth of gold as collateral, and give him 75% on it, RM600,000. BUT, the interest (they call it a protection fee for storing the gold) is based on the 800k, and they charge 1% per month!

So, now Bob has RM600k in his pocket, 600k debt, and 800k being held as collateral. The 800k is an asset, but a quasi asset, as people who have failed to service their loans would know!

He also has a promise from Genneva that they will buy his 800k gold for RM1m. He also has incoming 20k per month from Genneva and -8k a month from Al-Rajhi. Sounds good so far, right?

.....cont Part 3

Part 1

What the newspapers didn't mention on Genneva -> Financial Ruin for some.

The newspapers only mentioned that investors will lose a source of monthly revenue, and also that they stand to lose the 20%-30% markup they paid for their purchased gold.

So, someone who had RM1,000,000 in the bank, and bought RM800,000 worth of gold with it stands to lose RM200,000, right? Not good, but still survivable, right? Not for some.

For some, the scenario is much MUCH worse, thanks to many Genneva clients taking stupid advice from the Genneva agents to "leverage" their income.

Because the suggested method was through Islamic Banking quasi loans with the gold as collateral. Let me give an example of what happens using the same above ex-millionaire.

........cont Part 2

1. The Madoff family gained unusual access to Washington's lawmakers and regulators through the industry's top trade group. Madoff offered steady returns to his clientele. Some Madoff investors were wary of removing their money from his fund, in case they could not get back in later. An unnamed investor remarked, "The returns were just amazing and we trusted this guy for decades — if you wanted to take money out, you always got your check in a few days. That’s why we were all so stunned.

2. Well folks, the above sound familiar ....... Is Geneva using influential people to decieve & lure purchasers from their real business activity? BNM has raided the goldcos and the truth will prevail soon.

For the time being folks, the victims will have to live with the pain that GM2 caused them. It's going to hurt them for the rest of their lives. An expensive lesson learned? Hahahahahahahah!!

1. These CON-sultans know that they are the ones that have absolutely DESTROYED the lives of 60,000 customers which includes old uncles and aunties, pakcik and makcik, retirees and pensioners, sick cancer, kidney,etc patients, single mothers, widows etc., NOT BNM or the authorities.

2. Well I hope these CONs can sleep well after reality bites. The courts and authorities do not act or decide based upon the so-called human interest stories (sob sob stories). They look for facts and solid evidence, accounting records, financial statements, assets, liabilities, profits, payments etc.

3. Purchasers should now be very wary and cautious of people who act like they are saving the world by supporting gold scammers. Yes, BEWARE OF FALSE MESSIAHS.

Wakakakakakakakakakakakakakakakak!!

1. If Genneva collects RM10 - they pay RM2 for hibah, RM1 for agent's commission and operation costs, RM5 they masuk pocket leaving only RM2 in cash/assets.

2. Thats why the Con-sultans have been pressuring new customers with all kind of ridiculous promotions and some urging them even to take personal bank loans to purchase this fraudulent scheme.

3. More and more new purchasers are needed to enable their ponzi pyramid to survive.

So folks, who has the last laugh now? Wakakakakakakakakakakakakakakakak!!

Genneva Disgruntled Customer Group comment:-

Why Genneva consultant are still supporting Genneva?

Very simple, cause all their clients are their friends and relative. If they found out that the consultant has drag them in to a scam, they will be very unforgiving.

The only thing these consultant can do now is to promote that Bank Negara rob their money, steal their wealth and prevent them from making anymore money.

All this is to get themselves out of the hot soup between their friends and relative they have help con to get the 1% commission each month.

To those victims, ask youself.....If you found out this is truly a scam, would you not force the consultant to pay you back your investment?


Hahahahahahahha!!......No doubt about it most of them still (CONsultants & investors)utterly delusional, irrational and in denial. That explain why they are an easy prey!! Heheheheheheheh!!

Genneva Disgruntled Customer Group comment:-

Consultant is asking their investors not to make police report because they will fall in the tricks of Bank Negara. That is not true.

If the investor lodge a police report, the consultant will be implicated to the case thus:

Consultants could be charge the following under Malaysia Penal Code:
Section 120A: Criminal Conspiracy
Section 267: Making or selling false weights or measure
Section 415: Cheating
These charges carry 5-7 years imprisonment and fine

Under the Contract Law of Malaysia, Consultant can be sue for:
Section 16: Undue Influence
Section 17: Fraud
Section 18: Void Agreement
These cases where consultants can be made personally liable for the lost of money due to the scam of Genneva as they are also one of them with financial gain by selling you the scheme.

So folks, if you are one of the victim care to share your opinion on this?

Comment by Salahuddin Al-Ayyubi

1. The Management Team of Genneva Malaysia must be held liable for all this mess. Clients should direct their anger, take legal action for compensation on their loss of capital from the Management Team and Consultants who may have misled them and not giving them full disclosure on the undercurrent problems that started to surface many months before the BNM raid, such as being non-compliant to Syariah (yes since October 2011) and being non-compliant to BAFIA, long delay of purchased gold bars' delivery)

2. Despite reminders by concerned consultants to remove the word "Syariah" from the Genneva Malaysia's official website (after National Fatwa Council decided that GMSB's gold trading business is not syariah-compliant on 11th of July 2012) no swift action was taken by the Management Team to rectify the issue.

3. The website was shut down temporarily and amended ONLY after PPIM lodged a police report unto Genneva Malaysia for misleading the public on being syariah-compliant thus making the HIBAH (income generated) non-syariah too.

4. Concerned consultants have even asked the Management Team, why is it that the Trust Account used to receive monies from clients has NEVER BEEN setup properly with independent third party Corporate Trustee governed by Trustee Act 1949 be appointed as custodian to this Trust Account? And this too has fallen on deaf ears.

5. The delivery of purchased gold bars to clients have been delayed from 7 days to 14 days to 21 days and towards the end to close to 30 days. Anybody with right mind should be worried about this.... but since the main objective of buying this mark-up gold bars is not really the gold bars, but the HIBAH, clients do not mind at all with this delay.

Any victims here who care to share their views on this scheme?

248 posts


Posted by BullBear > Oct 12, 2012 08:52 AM | Report Abuse X

Based on information received by BNM, below is the list of known companies and websites which are not authorised nor approved under the relevant laws and regulations administered by BNM:

Public Gold Sdn Bhd - Date Added to Alert List on 27/09/2012. View here: http://www.bnm.gov.my/documents/2012/Financial_Consumer_Alert_listEN_Sept.pdf

Careful now, folks!

The great ponzi raid spreading to Singapore? Bad news indeed for ponzi consultants and supporters. Now folks, who’s stupid or brave enough to put fresh money in these scams?

Hahahahahahahahahahah~!!

Well, not wasting energy loh ........ just adding salt to their injury mah ...... Wakakakakakakakak!!

Budget carrier AirAsia Bhd and Indonesian ally PT Fersindo Nusaperkasa are not buying PT Batavia Air now as all parties have failed to reach an agreement, Dow Jones Newswires quoted the Indonesian domestic airline as saying today.

So how now, folks?

Hahahahahahahah!! No money to be make here loh. Since early last year few of my frenz asking me to buy this gold loh ....... bunch of greedy frenz ......... said good investment loh & laughing all the way to the bank loh ........ Told them not to touch this scheme loh ........ well serve them right!!

Well folks, who have the last laugh now? Wakakakakakakakakakakakakak!!

The prediction on the collapse of Geneva House now turned into reality. See the headlines in printed & social media showing the con-sultants & clients all screaming "FOUL! MURDER! ETC" against BNM.

In fact, the victims' rage should be directed to the GM2 operators and all their lying con-sultants!

It is also alarming to note that there are now even more copycat schemes which are operating openly in Malaysia.

So folks, be smart and recognize the warning signs.

Genneva 1st generation was similarly raided in 2009 and until today not yet fully resolved, with RM47 million missing.

Now the questions:
1. Was GM1 found far short of the gold and the cash when raided some years back?
2. Was not Bestino found to have been short of RM411,000,000 belonging to 6,700+ investors when raided some years back?

So folks, you think GM2 will be any different? Hahahahahahahah!!

Folks, maybe this raid was well planned by Genneva since early this year so they can blame it on the authority.

Now the question, folks. Will there be any GOLD bars left during the raid ?

It's a scam from day one (Samudra JV = GM1 = GM2). WHEN THE SOLDIERS CAN'T PERFORM ANYMORE (To Lure in new contract $ to pay the old hibah/commission) THAT'S THE TIME TO ESCAPE.

What say you, folks? Hahahahahahaha!!

1. Please view here: http://www.bnm.gov.my/index.php?ch=en_financialconsumeralert&lang=en#con_alert

List of companes & website

2. Further news on Public Gold: http://www.publicgoldsarawak.com/ver2/about-public-gold-2/

GENNEVA’S GAME PLAN by PC Wong - Final Part

# What if the price of gold does not shoot through the roof? The Genneva options:

(1). The Park In scheme whereby you leave the gold with them and they pay you more hibah. REALITY: Your gold is used to sell to other buyers.
(2). Renting gold to Genneva for profit. REALITY: Sell your gold to others, your money investment not backed by gold.
(3). Safe Keeping Receipt. REALITY: Same as above.
(4). Secretly arranging Bank Negara to raid the Company, after hiding away all the money and the gold, then blame the GOVT for spoiling the party.
(5). Declare bankruptcy/insolvency and walk away, of course after hiding all the money and the gold.

# Options 1 – 3 are to buy time in the hope that the gold price will suddenly shoot through the roof.

CONCLUSIONS
##############

# Genneva is a huge money scam, a PONZI.

# The hibah are paid out of investors’ own money.

# Genneva is making a gigantic gamble on the continued spectacular rise in gold price, using OPM.

# Last year the gold price went up to USD1,900/oz; that was the time Genneva should have taken profits, close down the operations. But they got greedy and got caught in their own belief that gold price will shoot up to USD5,000 or 10,000 as predicted by some oracles eg Peter Schiff etc (featured in Genneva Facebook).

# The current sideways movement of gold price is causing intolerable cash flow problems to Genneva because hibah and commission payments are overly lucrative. See what is happening in Genneva S’pore – read hardwarezone Sg website.

GENNEVA IS TAKING A MASSIVE GAMBLE WITH THE INVESTORS’ MONEY. IN THIS GAME, IT IS HEADS GENNEVA WINS, TAILS INVESTORS LOSE. DO NOT GET INVOLVED IN THIS MONEY SCAM, OR GET OUT WHILE YOU STILL CAN!!

GENNEVA’S GAME PLAN by PC Wong - Part I

# Genneva paid up is RM50,000. The plan is to use Other People’s Money (“OPM”) to make a profit, to get rich quick.

# It is a fact of life that a sucker is born every second, so there are no shortage of suckers to lead up the garden path, to take for a ride, to part them from their money. KLANG Valley has population of 5 million approx. If 10 % of these are working adults with some money savings, there are 500,000 potential victims. But not all are gullible or greedy people. Say out of these 500k ppl, one in 25 are gullible and greedy, so the no. of potential victims is 20,000. See the size of the market for Genneva?

# The GMs, and the general public, are aware of the phenomenal rise in gold price in recent years. The time seems right to build up the hype concerning the superlative advantages of gold commodity investment.

# The GMs, genuinely or otherwise, reach the conclusion that gold will continue it’s price surge upwards, inexorably. To profit massively, massive bets must be made with huge positions taken. To do this, huge leverage is needed and what better way than to do this with OPM.

# For Dragon Year promo the Genneva offer was that you buy their gold at GOLDBEAM price (25% over spot price), you receive hibah or dividend 3% pm for 3 months (total 9%), and they. guarantee buy back at original price at end of term. Reportedly RM800m worth of gold was sold.

# The GMs’ expectation, prediction and gamble was that gold would have gone up by more than 25% over the contract term. If this had indeed happened the investors needed not to sell back the gold. Then GMs would have collected a cool RM800m x (20% markup- 9% hibah) = RM88m profit.

# Can you imagine RM88m profit from a RM50,000 investment over 3 months? This is the Genneva gamble !! Do you know that the GMs would have pulled off this stunt if indeed the price of gold had shot through the roof?

1. Several clients and gold traders of the company cried foul over the raid.

2. A trader, who only wished to be known as Nick, said money earned from the purchase and sale of gold had helped fund his son through university.

3. "There has never been any complaint by the clients. The company has helped the livelihood of thousands of people. Why are the authorities interfering in a legitimate business?" he asked.

4. Another trader, S. Shanti, said the money from her buying and selling of gold, which she stressed was done with the relevant documentation and tax deductions, had helped pay for her mother's dialysis weekly treatment costing RM1,000 over the past three years.

5. "If they put a stop to this company, how am I going to foot the expensive bill for my mother's health?" she asked outside the company's office in Jalan Kuchai Maju 6.

Folks, the comments above just shows the level of greed of the people and still calling it a legitimate business. Cannot expect from people who invest in Genneva to be intelligent or have any rational thinking as you can definitely see from this kind of comments.

And jumping from GM1 to GM2 or other "gold investment company" in the BNM investor alert list shows what kind of intelligence people have.

Folks, serve them right! Agree?........Hahahahahahah!!

1. 2012 has been predicted as the end of the world or the end of human civilization, a view attributed by some contemporary writers to an ancient Mayan prophecy.

2. Well folks, I think it is more likely 2012 will spell the end of Genneva Gold. The world, however, will remain safe. So will those smart enough not to get involved in High Yield Investment schemes again!

Hahahahahahahaha!!

Well folks, GM2 gave them a short happiness which has turned into a long misery.

I hope this has taught them a lesson: Probably an expensive lesson learned indeed but sadly GREED never learn! Wakakakakakakakak!!

Well folks, when the make money the are laughing all the way to the bank. When GM2 got raided they blame it's the world's fault!

Sadly folks, there are still people falling into the same trap all over again.

Samudra JV = GM1 = GM2 = Gold Scam!! Hahahahahaha!!

So folks, watch out for overzealous sales pitches! If a telemarketer says an investment is risk-free, or guarantees high profits with very low risk, think twice - especially you're pressured to act quickly.

If it's too good to be true I bet it's a SCAM!

Source: The Business Times Singapore (Tuesday, September 25th 2012) -
Gold Trading Firm Taken to Court By Customer By Genevieve Chua


While the media in Singapore is warning the public on gold-guaranteed schemes, it’s highly unfortunate that our fellow Malaysians are getting into such schemes after being lured with high returns & free iPads.

Well folks, blinded by greed!! Serve them right? You tell me, folks! Hahahahahahaha!!

KUALA LUMPUR Oct 10

1. The recent raids on companies suspected of operating illegal investment schemes using gold were conducted in the interest of protecting investors as well as the public at large from falling victims to the illegal schemes.

2. In a joint statement today the Attorney General’s Chambers the Royal Malaysia Police and Bank Negara Malaysia said based on surveillance and examination conducted on these companies it has been discovered that these companies are operating schemes that are believed to be not sustainable to provide the promised high monthly returns nor would they be able to provide the buy-back guarantee of gold.

3. Such schemes are not sustainable because the returns promised are not funded through gold trading but from the monies invested into such schemes.

4. The investigations have also revealed that the amount of assets and monies held by these companies do not commensurate with the amount collected from their investors the agencies said.

5. The statement added that prior to the joint raids it has been noticed that these companies have delayed in returning gold or money to the investors within the stipulated time as promised.

6. Such signs are early warning indications prior to the collapse of such schemes that would result in significant losses to investors they said.

So folks, if it's to good to be true you can bet it's a SCAM!! Wakakakakakak!!

Well to those victims no one put a gun at your head to force you to buy. Anyway JUST BRACE YOURSELF FOR THE CONSEQUENCES. IF PEOPLE DO NOT LEARN FROM HISTORY, THEY WILL REPEAT AND BECOME HISTORY....hahahahaa

Well folks, blinded by greed sympthom!

Just a thought, and hope those in know are able to share: -

1) Are those consultants / agents selling the scheme on behalf of GM2 be held liable to all those who had bought from them as well?

2) Now that investors are not able to call up GM2, they will surely look up the agents that sell them the scheme. How would these consultants / agents response? Will they be held responsible as well, especially by those who had yet to receive their gold bars after payment had been made?

3) When GM1 was raided by BNM, what happened to their consultants / agents? Had any of them been sued by their clients?

Folks, any comment?? Heheheheheh!!

To those GM2 folks, just for your info! Heheheheheheh!!

The Business Times © Singapore Press Holdings Limited 25 Sept 2012
======================================================

1. [SINGAPORE] Genneva Pte Ltd, a gold trading company offering a “buyback” scheme, appears to be in hot water.

2. At least one customer has recently won an interlocutory judgment against it in the Subordinate Court, pending an assessment of damages. It remains to be seen, however, whether she will recover her claim of about $190,000. Genneva failed to respond to the writ of summons or to contest the case.

3. The plaintiff, Lee Bee Ghok, is represented by Goh Kok Yeow of De Souza Lim & Goh.

4. A second writ of summons has also been filed in the Subordinate Court claiming a total sum of roughly $86,000.

5. A number of other customers are also looking into launching a lawsuit against the firm for its alleged failure to honour its part of the agreement to buy back gold. One group of about 60 customers, representing a total of roughly $10 million in gold purchases, is understood to be consulting lawyers.

6. Genneva is on the Monetary Authority of Singapore’s Investor Alert list of unlicensed entities. Its scheme basically sells gold to customers at a hefty premium of 20-30 per cent. Customers, however, are told that they enjoy a “discount” of about 2 per cent off the headline price.

7. They are given the option to sell back the gold after a pre-agreed term of one month or three months. The gold can be sold back at the headline price and customers get to pocket the so-called discount. Assuming monthly rollovers, this could mean a return of as much as 24 per cent a year.

8. Genneva’s website lists a price of $96 per gram as at August. This is the equivalent of about $96,000 per kilobar of gold. UOB, which offers gold investment services, sells gold to the public at about $74,500 per kilobar.

9. Sources said that the firm had also offered a “safekeeping receipt” (SKR) scheme some years ago, where the customer does not take delivery of physical gold. The gold is held by the company for safekeeping, and customers can exercise the option to withdraw via a “sellback”.

10. Genneva director Leow Wee Khong could not be reached. Calls and e-mail to the company were not answered.

11. More recently, a source said, customers were marketed a scheme similar to SKR, but under a contract linked to a Malaysian company.

12. BT understands that in the last few months, customers have not been able to sell back their gold. Agents are also owed commissions for up to six or seven months. Customers that BT spoke with managed to make at least one rollover, earning 2 per cent, after which some invested yet more money.

13. Spot gold price touched a high of US$1,888 per ounce last year. It is now trading at US$1,759.

14. Customers who bought from Genneva are in a bind because of the high premium paid. Those BT spoke with paid between $91,000 and $93,000 per kilobar. UOB will buy back from the public at about $69,400 based on yesterday’s indicative prices.

15. Some customers are believed to have filed police reports. A police spokesman said: “It is inappropriate to comment on police investigations, if any.”

16. Based on Genneva’s latest available filings, 2009 revenue came to $236 million. Assets totalled $67 million and liabilities, $68 million. Paid-up capital came to $500,000. The company was registered in 2008 with four directors, three of whom are Malaysian.

17. The three Malaysians – Marcus Yee Yuen Seng, Ng Poh Weng and Chin Wai Leong – are also directors of Genneva Sdn Bhd (GM1). They are being sued by Bank Negara in Malaysia for alleged illegal deposit taking and alleged offences under anti-money laundering laws. The case is ongoing.

18. In Singapore, there are four apparently related Genneva companies registered as businesses. Apart from Genneva Pte Ltd, there is also Genneva Remittance, set up ostensibly for remittance services, and Genneva Syariah, described as gold bullion traders and dealers.

19. In March, Genneva World Pte Ltd was registered also for gold trading. It has six Singaporean directors, one of whom is Mr Leow, the Genneva director.

20. Customers are concerned that assets of Genneva are being transferred to Genneva World, which is expected to trade on a similar business model. Sources say that some customers have been invited to transfer their contracts to Genneva World, but they are asked to keep 30 per cent of their gold holding with the company.

21. Genneva’s model appears to fall into a grey regulatory area. Because there is typically a physical purchase of gold, the company is not classified as an investment adviser. The so-called discount that customers are extended is also not described as a yield or return.

Greed will always leave you dissatisfied because you'll never be able to get everything you desire. Greed never allows you to think you have enough; it always destroys you by making you strive ever harder for more.

The Straits Times (Singapore)dated 27/09/12: - It citied recent reports where Genneva, a gold trading company offering a buyback scheme, had been taken to court by a customer claiming $190,000.

Genneva is on the Monetary Authority of Singapore’s (MAS) Investor Alert List of unlicensed entities.

Other customers are also reportedly considering suing the company for its alleged failure to honor its part of the agreement to buy back gold.

To GM2 so called investors & con-sultants.

1. If money is, as it is often posited, the root of all evil, then where does that leave greed?

2. Let's do the math: Greed takes up most of your time and most of your money, so therefore greed = time x money. And, as we all know, time = money. Ergo, greed = money x money. So, if money is the square root of all evil, then we are forced to conclude that greed is evil as well, perhaps even more so, in that it forced us to do math.


3. But when does the desire to simply possess something turn into unchecked greed? That's easy: when the things that you possess start possessing you.

Heheheheheheh!!

1. To be fair to BNM, they have issue repeated warnings against involvement with organisations in their alert list but the customers led by the con-sultans had been blinded by their greed and lure of easy money.

2. To be fair to all the victims, these Con-Sultan must be answerable to the law as well – as they are the tentacles of GM2. Earning commission to sustain their golf, international schools for the kids,overseas holidays/education, luxury cars, bungelows and gold hoards at the expense of all these victim is not only illegal, but immoral.

3. Folks, it will be good that all these Con-sultan marched all the way to Putrajaya (as they are planning) to submit themselves to the law. The palace of justice awaits them with an open arm – that we should be assured of, and victims should take comfort of.

Wakakakakakakakakak!!

“I can understand all the frustration that is being aired here. And it appears Genneva has been deliverying what they promised but forced to freeze their activities.

However let me explain my view on the technical flaw in this scheme that warrants BNM to take such drastic action. My intention of giving my view is to help enlightened and hopefully will help many here to ask the right questions and direct it to the right party.

In any trading; there must be willing buyer & seller for a transaction to take place at a price agreeable by both parties. The seller will profit from the transaction and the buyer will receive the goods / service. Very clear cut exchange.

However in this scheme, technically the seller do not ‘realized’ its profit yet from the transaction because there is a contractual obligation that a monthly ‘gift’ of 2-3% is given to the buyer and the buyer has the option to sell back the gold at the original purchased price. In this aspect, the seller’s obligations to the buyer becomes a Liability to the seller. To put it in another words, it is the buyer that will receive the profits rather than the seller in this transaction scheme.

Therefore technically this transaction scheme cannot be deemed as trading because the seller doesn’t profit from the goods sold. If it is not trading then where does this lead to?
My next statement may sound absurd and may anger many of you here but please bear with me. My intention is to explain so we can have better judgement & help us understand why Bank Negara has to step in and take drastic measure.

I am saying this scheme is not trading because it is more inclined to money lending business which must be regulated under our Malaysia law. Yes, I just said it; this Genneva scheme is basically a money lending scheme misrepresented as gold trading scheme.

How can this be? You may say there is a sales purchase agreement and gold transacted then how can this be money lending? If its money lending scheme then who is lending to who?

In this scheme, you are the lender. Genneva is the borrower. You bear the financial risk, in return Genneva pays you the monthly interest as we know it as Hibah. At the end of the loan contract, Genneva returns the money to you. During the contract, you keep the gold bar as your collateral if in the event Genneva fails to pay; you don’t loose the full amount lent to Genneva.

If the deal is purely buy & sell with no contractual obligation; then it is clear curlt trading because seller profits and buyer keep the goods. But if there is a contractual obligations for monthly interest & buy back then it is surely money lending, the gold serves as the collateral; the lender profits and the borrower bears the liability.

This issuance of collateral gold is somewhat similar to companies issuing bonds to raise fund from the public. Bonds are meticulously regulated by Securities Commission & Bank Negara because it has to be secured against the company assets such as properties and etc.

The problem with Genneva is that they are not regulated and when they have more buyers (lenders) they are actually increasing the liabilities of the company while profit is not realized yet.

For a typical trading company, the more customers; the more goods trade out, the more profits realized. Clear cut profit realization. For example RM 1 billion of gold sold would generate certain amount of profit based on the profit margin.

However Genneva’s scheme, the more gold sold the more liability it creates for the company because of the obligations to buy back and pay the monthly gift. Therefore Bank Negara had to step in to ensure things are in order and to prevent it to get out of control.

A small complaint would suffice to fuel the urgency for drastic action. It is harsh but neccesary.” - This was a comment made by Richard Chew.

Folks, again judge for youeself Heheheheheheheh!!

To those so called "investors" which are actually just a customers, please join in the discussions and let the truth be known. Heheheheh!!

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Genneva-Customer-Support-Group/162867987187986

1. Did you read the recent papers and the TV news? Look at all this pathetic people, shouting, screaming and now wanna do a march to Putrajaya just to support GM2?

2. Serve them all right! No one point a gun at their heads demanding them to invest with GM2 in the first place. Moreover they are just being ignorant to know the fact of this is one of the risk and they just blindly believe and they just want to hear what the agent told them abt the 2% profit every month.

3. Now they say it's the whole world fault, BNM’s fault but not theirs'(GREED)! Hahahahahahaha!!

4. The collapse of Genneva S’PORE is now all over the news. Channel 8 TV Sg featured a broadcast about “THE GENNEVA GOLD SCAM”. An investor sued GEN Sg and nobody turned up to defend the suit.

5. So folks, watch out for overzealous sales pitches! If a con-sultant says an investment is risk-free, or guarantees high profits with very low risk, think twice - especially you're pressured to act quickly.

If it's too good to be true then it's probably a scam.

If Genneva is a legit company:
1. Why did they fail to comply with the rules and not submit the necessary statutory docs?
2. Why did they not act fast and clear their own name when they first got listed under BNM’s alert list?
3. Why did they list themselves as a trading company and yet sell their product like investment? They even call their clients investors. Shouldn’t they call them customers?
4. Why did Genneva S’pore also got raided at the same time? If BNM made a mistake or acting like bully, are you saying S’pore’s authorities are also making a mistake and bullying their citizens?

If Genneva really have a legitimate secret formula to generate such high returns:
1. Why did they not establish themselves as an investment company first?
2. Why did they not set up their company in Wall Street first? Surely they can make more money there, right?
3. Why do they need to operate like MLM and ask their customers to ‘recruit’ new customers? If their formula is so good, then they would have been famous even just by word of mouth. No need to spend more money paying incentive to the ‘consultants’. Ever heard Warren Buffet setting up a company and recruit like MLM?
4. Why operate from a shop lot in Kuchai Lama? Can’t they afford to rent an office in the Twin Towers? After all they are dealing with gold, right? A more prestigious address can only help boost the image right?
5. Why target all the aunties and uncles as clients? Should they not target the banks and financial institutions? Surely banks and financial institutions have way more capital to invest and make more money in a shorter period of time.

Shouldn’t they at least have a corporate arm to sell to corporate clients? Surely companies want to make money too, right?
Imagine that Genneva has a team of people that can outperform even the best in Wall Street and can reduce Warren Buffet to a footnote.

Why hide and pander to retail customers like uncles and aunties only?
Remember folks, the last person who claimed to be able to consistently turn in profit just a tad higher than the Wall Street experts was Bernard Madoff. He’s behind bars now and is charged with running the biggest ever Ponzi scheme uncovered so far.

If Genneva is legit, shouldn’t they come clean and prove to the world that they do have the magic formula? If they did this then they would be allowed to resume business and will have more customers than they could handle not only in M’sia but the whole world. Why aren’t they doing that?

Folks, judge for yourself! Heheheheheh!!

Say whatever you want but the most important thing I made a killing in this stock. Hope that you guys are not stuck at a higher price. Will be back soon if smell of opportunity again!

Wakakakakakakakakakakak!!

Well folks, thanks to you guys & gals I made fat profits and now with zero exposure on AA again. Well, one of the funny things about the stock market is that every time one person buys, another sells, and both think they are astute.

Remember folks, I am neither a bear nor a bull, I am an opportunist. I want to make money short- and long-term. I want to find good situations and exploit them.

Heheheheheheh..........adious!!

Well, good luck! May the force still be with Airasia!

1. The Edge on 14/9/12 - AirAsia rebounds 5% mid-morning, after 10% sell down (Rm3.10)

2. The Edge on 27/9/12 - Hot Stock: AirAsia rebounds from year-low on possible fund buying (Rm2.91)

Wowwwwwwwwww ...... Ain't this Airasia most famous marketing strategy or the Edge just mocking Airasia famous "Hot seat"?

Folks, people do have very short memories.

On 14/9/12 AirAsia rebounded after three days of sell down, up 15 sen or 5.1% at RM3.10.

Yes folks, investors do have very short memories!!

Today technical rebound up only 0.06 cents mah! ..... but still down -0.73 cents from 1 month high loh! ...... Where got strenght loh ...... sleeping already loh cos exhausted and no more energy push higher mah!!

Hahahahahahha!!

Well folks, take profit on rallies as the stock will break into lower territory in due course, as it breached its key support areas recently.

If you don't believe, dare to buy now? Wakakakakak!!

If stock market experts were so expert, they would be buying stock, not selling advice.

Well folks, if you believe on whats reported on the edge then what are you waiting for? ....... Buy loh!!

Heheheheheheh!!