Posted by qqq3 > Jun 6, 2019 4:02 PM | Report Abuse
your z score here z score there knows the problem meh?

I don't know the problem? Do you know how many articles I have shared in i3investor alone on Sendai since two three years ago when you were shouting sailang here sailang there and margin here and margin there?

They all came with numerous comments of qqq, stockmanny, and maybe Desa6769, Lonranger, Brightsmart. Go back and read the threads and the silly comments you put up there.

Posted by qqq3 > Jun 5, 2019 6:32 PM | Report Abuse
kc...like I say, I am a pro....any thing also I do, good bad ugly also I do.......
but for novices, stick to quality, low turnover should be better than your value here, value there, Z score here, Z score there.


Z score here Z Score there?
You know what; when you were touting sailang and margin two years ago on Sendai, telling everyone to follow your sailang here sailang there, margin here margin there on Sendai, the Z-score then was already telling you a big red flag as below,

X1 = Working Capital / Total Assets 0.15734
X2 = Retained Earnings / Total Assets 0.01956
X3 = Earnings before Interest and Taxes / Total Assets -0.04723
X4 = Market Value Equity / Book Value of Total Liabilities 0.51650
X5 = Sales / Total Assets 0.53073
Z 0.90097

So was Z Score a good predictor on rubbish stock Sendai?

Absolutely!

Posted by new_in_share > Jun 6, 2019 12:09 PM | Report Abuse
Dear KC Chong, thank for info. Can you tell where(web link) to get latest Bursa listed companies Altman Z-score. Again thanks in advance.

Hi new_in_share,

I hardly use Altman z-Score as I always try to find good companies to invest in, as good companies always have very high Z-score because of their consistent earnings and healthy balance sheets.

You should do that too. But in case you need to check z-Score because someone tells you to buy a random stock, here is a link which I just found out. Courtesy of king36 in his comments in this thread.

https://www.isaham.my/stock/awc

Posted by qqq3 > Jun 6, 2019 1:12 AM | Report Abuse
kc.....................high Z scores....I would assume all cash rich companies have high z scores,
other companies with high z scores.......companies in matured industries, companies over the hill, companies worth more dead than alive, companies with lousy growth prospects, companies with Directors without ambitions, companies investors call value traps..........and prominently in last few years, red chips with manipulated accounts.


Hey ""Accountant"", look at the formula for Z-Score and those metrics used, which of your 7 categories of companies above fit the high Z-score you claimed to be? Name just one, not necessary all 7 and explain to justify if you have any common sense at all.

X1 = Working Capital / Total Assets
X2 = Retained Earnings / Total Assets
X3 = Earnings before Interest and Taxes / Total Assets
X4 = Market Value Equity / Book Value of Total Liabilities
X5 = Sales / Total Assets

Z = 1.20(X1) + 1.40 (X2) +3.30(X3) +.60(X4) + 1.0(X5)

King36,

I have not used this ratio before. Goggling it there is an academic paper by Beaver William. You may learn something from there.

Anyway, when you invest in good companies, which you should instead of speculating, you need not go through these kinds of checks, unless you are thinking of shorting stocks, which itself is even a more speculative endeavor.

Posted by qqq3 > Jun 5, 2019 6:32 PM | Report Abuse
kc...like I say, I am a pro....any thing also I do, good bad ugly also I do.......
but for novices, stick to quality, low turnover should be better than your value here, value there, Z score here, Z score there.

You are a ""pro""? There are many kinds of ""Pro"". Pro in cheating, in swindling, in bullshitting, in lying, in PLP, slandering, etc.

Which one or all of the above?

Posted by king36 > Jun 5, 2019 7:14 PM | Report Abuse
TQ KC.
Always learn from reading your blog.
BTW, what is "BEAVER"? How do we calculate it and apply it as you have explained above?

Glad that you learn something.

What is "BEAVER"? I don't get your question.

Posted by kcchongnz > May 12, 2013 1:37 PM | Report Abuse X
The Unloved Altman Z Score for KNM
Z = 1.2X_1 + 1.4X_2 + 3.3X_3 + 0.6X_4+1X_5
From the last financial statements of KNM, Z=0.54

Posted by kcchongnz > May 15, 2013 7:25 AM | Report Abuse X
The Unloved Altman Z Score for Ivory
Z 1.700


Some one brought up my post in i3investors 6 years ago on Altman Z-score with certain motive.

The above two companies' Z-scores were done 6 years ago with the conclusion that both companies were having high risk of bankruptcy.

None of them went bankrupt. However the share prices of these two companies had lost 70% or more since then while the overall market has gone up.

5/13/2013 6/5/2019
KNM 0.6 0.185 -69.2%
Ivory 0.75 0.195 -74%

Posted by qqq3 > Jun 4, 2019 9:30 PM | Report Abuse
for pros like me, I do every thing, any thing, good , bad ugly also I do.

Pro? The performance of the portfolios below shouted sailang and margin by you in the last 3 years surely reflects the "pro" in you.

Stock price then 5-Jun-2019 Gain/loss Gain/loss %
Jaks 1.80 0.73 -1.07 -59%
Sendai 1.40 0.415 -0.99 -70%
Bornoil 0.10 0.045 -0.055 -55%
CBIP 2.25 1.01 -1.24 -55%
Ecoworld 1.29 0.855 -0.435 -34%
Taan 4.79 2.4 -2.39 -50%
Jtiasa 1.35 0.49 -0.86 -64%
Genting w 1.07 0 -1.07 -100%


Stock 10/31/2018 6/5/2019
KESM 12.00 7.00 -41.7%
Layhong 0.400 0.420 5.0%
Seacara 0.280 0.220 -21.4%
D&O 0.890 0.620 -30.3%
Elsoft 1.29 0.785 -39.2%
Hibiscus 1.12 1.04 -7.1%
Pmetal 5.15 4.32 -16.1%

Posted by (US/CHN trade war doesn't matter) Philip > Jun 5, 2019 7:18 AM | Report Abuse
The fine tuning of ratios were based on taking a group of US companies performance 40 years ago to define what is risk. It is very difficult to apply to a group of US companies in 2000, much less comparing Bursa companies in 2019. The definitions are very very different here from my experience.

That is true. Unless someone here has done some recent research in Malaysia and come out with our multivariate regression model from local companies which had bankrupted, the model can only be used as a guide at best. But again, we may not really have long enough history and adequate sample size to do so.

But if we look at the metrics used; it is still an intuitive method to be used as an additional wedge in our golf bag.

The z-score punishes companies with high leverage. If a company has less net working capital in relation to total asset (X1), it is at risk of bankruptcy as it will not be able to fulfil its short-term payment obligation if forced to (some limitations here as some good companies need little or no working capital). If a company has little retained earnings (X2), it has to fund its growth with excessive debts which makes it risky. If its return on assets (X3) is low, it is not good as earnings may not be enough to pay debts. If the market value of the company is low in relation to its total liabilities, and hence debts (X4), further deterioration endangers its survival. If the asset turnover (X5) is low, how is the company going to make decent return justifying the assets and hence the debts it uses?

So Z-score can be a good guide for the general public to avoid investing in stock tips and rumours. Sendai is one of the best example in i3investor.

I hardly use Z-score, except for teaching purpose, as I never buy risky companies with precarious balance sheet and poor return on assets. Neither do you need to, unless of course if you think about shorting companies, but shorting itself is a risky endeavour.

Posted by qqq3 > May 28, 2019 5:07 PM | Report Abuse
cashfow of sendai becomes very healthy with huge collections from debtors while Dayang goes unhealthy......so how?


Huge collection from debtors? Sure or not? How did the cash flows become healthy? By being a ""smelly foot"" by not paying subcontractors?

I am sure being an ""accountant"" you would know how to read the balance sheet and cash flows statement.

Posted by Choivo Capital > May 29, 2019 12:31 AM | Report Abuse
I would consider taking out 25 to 30% to buy Singaporean reits. And maybe another 10% for China index.


It depends on individual risk profile. This article is written for those who are risk averse. The aim is the saving must meet the basic requirements for the estimated number of years in retirement. He must be able to sleep well without having to worry he outlives his saving too soon due to events which are not controllable.

Posted by ks55 > May 29, 2019 12:26 AM | Report Abuse

ks55, thanks for your comments. Valuable from one who has been there done that. Just a comment on your point no.3 below,

3. Take out your money from EPF and put into a few selected Reits. Some Reits command 6 to 10% yield at present price, and they are way below net tangible asset to serve as safety of margin. You will enjoy both recurrent income and capital appreciation.


Reits, like any other stock, are subject to market risk. for example, the performance of Malaysian REITs was uninspiring through most of 2018. Bursa’s REIT Index finished at 928.81 points on Dec 31, 2018, translating into a decline of 12.2% from 1,057.35 points on Dec 29, 2017, under-performing the benchmark FBM KLCI by nearly twice as much.

I also have other reservation of reits as in the link below,

https://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/kcchongnz/171201.jsp

Posted by wlchew > May 28, 2019 4:43 AM | Report Abuse
just consider migrating to au or nz where people are more honest and reliable. There is no such thing as Religion Race or Royalty. Once you don't face the 3 R's you will live happier and make better decisions


The quality of life one can get from RM2.0m saving will be much lower than if he stays in Malaysia.

Everything is almost dollar-to-dollar. Unless one earns there and live there.

Posted by qqq3 > May 25, 2019 5:27 PM | Report Abuse
aiyah kc............Look at Dayang and PIE.....your kind of favorites FA.....so how?
u say you teach people to fish not give fish to them....so u teach them to fish dayang and PIE , then how?

Are you sure you a 60+ year old retired accountant?

Your brain is like a three year old kid.

Anyway, this issue is closed. Let us not talk about it any more.

Posted by (US/CHN trade war doesn't matter) Philip > May 25, 2019 5:30 PM | Report Abuse
I learned something new today, kcchongz you did fund management as well? Thank God kyy did not engage cabin tan.
>>>>>>>
I sacked him because he has no business sense at all. I am not telling you a fairy tale because many people in CIMB know this episode.
>>>>
https://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/koonyewyinblog/110760.jsp


No, I never do fund management when kyy requested me to manage his money. He even requested me to manage his wife money. They were explained in the link below,

https://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/kcchongnz/110836.jsp

Posted by qqq3 > May 25, 2019 3:35 PM | Report Abuse
kc.............just look at Dayang and PIE..............u can honestly say yours and OTB FA can pakai?
small caps PL fly here fly there.............


Who had written the most articles published in i3investor to ask people to buy Dayang?

Do you find a single article written by KC to ask people to buy Dayang?

PIE? Has KC written an analysis on PIE and published in i3investor?

Small cap fly here fly there? How many stock not flying here and there in the last couple of years? Not Jaks and Sendai?

But which stocks were some of the worst?

How many stocks can beat these stocks touted by quack quack quack in Jaks and Sendai, plus sailang and margin, which had lost 70% in the last two years?

Posted by qqq3 > May 24, 2019 2:35 AM | Report Abuse
kyy, 30 m shares only.....maybe less.


30m * 0.92 = RM27.6m.

What was his wealth in Jaks and Sendai 2 years ago before he got to know you?

Posted by qqq3 > May 25, 2019 11:42 AM | Report Abuse
PIE shows the futility of FA OTB/KC style without a broader perspective...................

None of KC's stocks shared in i3investor ended up like Jaks and Sendai as touted by the quack quack quack, aka Stockmanny, Brighsmart, Lonranger, Desa6769 etc.

Stock Peak price Now Loss
Jaks 1.80 0.705 -61%
Sendai 1.40 0.400 -71%

All those cheated by quack quack quack lost their underwear in just two years.

All of them beat any selection of quack quack quack in the last few years as below,

Stock price then 5/21/2019 Gain/loss Gain/loss %
Bornoil 0.10 0.045 -0.055 -55%
CBIP 2.25 1.04 -1.21 -54%
Ecoworld 1.29 0.86 -0.43 -33%
Taan 4.79 2.25 -2.54 -53%
Jtiasa 1.35 0.535 -0.815 -60%
Genting w 1.07 0 -1.07 -100%


And here,
Stock 10/31/2018 5/21/2019
KESM 12 7.51 -37.4%
Layhong 0.4 0.44 10.0%
Seacara 0.28 0.21 -25.0%
D&O 0.89 0.625 -29.8%
Elsoft 1.29 0.81 -37.3%
Hibiscus 1.12 1.07 -4.5%

Posted by qqq3 > May 21, 2019 5:43 PM | Report Abuse
kc...reading cash flow statement is easy.....what is not easy is sell at $ 1.70 and never look back........

Typical big liar and shiok sendiri. All the time when the price went up say from RM1.00 to RM1.70, and then down to RM1.15, he will say he sold at RM1.70.

When did you say you buy Dayang? Can show me your comment in i3investor ah?

But I did read his comments in i3investors for some stocks. These were the results when he promoted them in i3investor, and the prices now.

10/8/2018 5/21/2019
Sendai 0.8 0.4 -50.0%
Serba 4.15 4.04 -2.7%
Pmetal 5.15 4.26 -17.3%

And this
10/31/2018 5/21/2019
KESM 12 7.51 -37.4%
Layhong 0.4 0.44 10.0%
Seacara 0.28 0.21 -25.0%
D&O 0.89 0.625 -29.8%
Elsoft 1.29 0.81 -37.3%
Hibiscus 1.12 1.07 -4.5%

And this
Stock price then 5/21/2019 Gain/loss Gain/loss %
Bornoil 0.10 0.045 -0.055 -55%
CBIP 2.25 1.04 -1.21 -54%
Ecoworld 1.29 0.86 -0.43 -33%
Taan 4.79 2.25 -2.54 -53%
Jtiasa 1.35 0.535 -0.815 -60%

Every one lost money in huge amount. But he said he made 200% the last two years because he is a trading pro, going in buying lowest, and going out selling at highest, without any records.


So do we trust what a serial liar say without any published record, or the records as commented by him found in i3investor?

Posted by qqq3 > May 21, 2019 11:26 AM | Report Abuse
kc.....so why rights issue?? didn't u say cash flow so strong no need rights issue? now, rights issue and private placements and RPS and sukuk some more........what happened to the cashflow, kc?


I did say there are abundant free cash flows. Aren't you an accountant? If you are, how come you can't see, and even after I explain in details and showing those cash flows figures, you still got no idea at all?

How not to believe you are a fake accountant?

When did I say "no need rights issue". Can find it and copy and paste here, big liar?

Confidence, positive thinking in life is good.

Over-confidence, egoistic, over-positive thinking, only focus on winning as prime priority without taking consideration of risk, is definite bad for the outcome of investing.

Haven't we seen that before?

Yes, negative thinking, humility, cautious are definitely required in investing.

Posted by qqq3 > May 20, 2019 7:48 PM | Report Abuse
Quality first, then Value - investbullbear
kc....its working......everybody singing my tune...I am proud......

Posted by qqq3 > May 20, 2019 7:50 PM | Report Abuse
kc...u call me fake accountant ....but its working and I am proud......

Just by reading a short article making a statement that quality is more important than valuation and you jump with joy.

First of all, what has that to do with you as a follower?

Number 2, is there any evidence provided, or just a spurious statement?

Thirdly have you read opposite view provided by others, especially those successful investors such as Howard Marks in his book, The most important thing, or Seth Klarman in his Margin of Safety, Joel Greenblatt in his The little book which beats the market, Pat Dorsey and his five rules in stock investing, Zack Buckley in Road less travelled, Stocks for the long run, What has worked in investing etc. etc. and the numerous academic research?

Also read about the Dogs of Down when quality stocks were in euphoria and sold at high price.

I really don't know what to say about you making such childish statements, an accountant, and I don't wish to use harsh words on you too often.

Posted by qqq3 > May 19, 2019 10:09 PM | Report Abuse
why so many theory one?...if next year can make more money than this year and this year more than last year, than no reason for price to drop especially if PE is within reasonable range....lower the better.


So many theories?

You good friend has raised some pertinent points about the use of cash of the company which is an important aspect of management action in capital allocation in the light of investing in a company. It is also a major subject in accounting and corporate finance. I would expect an ""accountant"" would be able to contribute meaningfully.

Alas, just dreaming, I doubt this ""accountant"" even understand nor care what the subject is about.

The only thing he does is mimicking the quack of a duck.

First, all the actions above consume cash of the company, and hopefully this cash is from the free cash flows of the business, meaning all cash left after all expenses, tax, interest charges, and also capital expenses required to sustain and grow its core business.

Share repurchases by the company reduces the number of shares outstanding, and if cancelled, increases the EPS. But note cash has been consume for the repurchase, it only adds value if repurchase is carried out when the share price is undervalued, preferably way undervalued. But does the management always purchase shares when they are undervalued? Research has shown otherwise.

Share repurchase has an advantage in US as dividend is taxed twice and at a high rate in the hand of shareholders. But this is not true in Malaysia as tax on dividend is single tier, it is taxed only at source.
So is it better to have cash in your pocket to do what you like, rather than letting company doing share repurchase, hopefully when shares are undervalued, and that you can eventually share the increase in EPS, and when?

If debt is high and financial position of the company is weak, it is good to use FCF to reduce debts, and strengthens its balance sheet. But if the financial position is strong with little gearing, it is a non-productive action. In fact, it is a poor use of FCF, for debt is cheap and interest payment is tax- deductible. Companies with good cash flows use considerably high amount of debts because of this reason.

If you don't have income and you go to the bank for a loan for a house, do they lend you?

And when the company has no stable earnings and cash flows, which bank wants to lend you money?

Posted by Heavenly PUNTER Research IB > May 19, 2019 7:56 PM | Report Abuse
Unker, but ah most biotech companies like to keep their debt level zero, why ah? I always wonder why also... And when they need to raise funds, they tend to do private placements or right issues (which is oftentimes seen as bad). You are right about the tax shield part...

They are new and have uncertain cash flows. If financial crisis come, how to pay interest? Can go bankrupt. That is why they use equity only.

Posted by pussycats > May 19, 2019 5:47 PM | Report Abuse
Posted by superbull11 > May 19, 2019 5:08 PM | Report Abuse
kcchongnz n KYY now become panic now , wanna SELL or HOLD also don;t know , Dayang will drop to 60 sen if weak QR appear ,dayang director will take oppoturity place right issue price fixed at 60 sen , KYY n kcchongnz kena play by Dayang company director , next week u will see margin call from KYY
=====
Kcchongnz didn't buy dayang lah.
He just use Dayang as an example in his writing lah.
LoL.

I do have some Dayang shares but why panic? Even if its shares tank so what? It is just a share in my diversified portfolio. Why have to panic when you are investing after thorough study, and investing with your own money, and not with margin.

If I speculate with margin finance like others and with huge stake, I may panic, because I may be wrong in my assessment too. With margin finance, it won't give you chance if you are wrong.

Posted by pjseow > May 18, 2019 8:44 PM | Report Abuse
With the 4 dividend payments of 12 sen each plus.a special dividend of 40 sen since the private placement , Tony of Airasia would have made almost 1 billion if he were to sell all the private placement at 2.70 which was the price 2 weeks ago. Tony was really smart to time his private placement at the right time. Dayang should time its placement for"" its other investors' when the company can deliver its best results which should be after announcing its q3 result. I supposed dayang is planning for that in DEC 2019 after q3 result is announced in end Nov

Hopefully I can use Dayang as a good example in the success of a rights issues and a private placement.

Posted by pjseow > May 18, 2019 8:25 PM | Report Abuse
Airasia had a private placement in 2016 where its CEO borrowed 1 billion ringgit to purchase the shares at 1.80. Since then the share prices went up to the peak of 4.66 before it came down to less than 3 due to poor Q4 result due to high oil prices. At the end of the days, it is the company performance which will.dictate the share prices.

Thanks for the excellent info. I will use this as an advantage of private placement in my book, plus a few others.

After dividend is paid out, share price will normally adjusted downwards as the value of the company has dropped by the amount of dividend payout, of course. But investors pocket the dividend, don't they?

The total return investing in stock is made up of capital gain plus dividend. Depending on holding period, for holding period of 20 years and more, dividend has been shown in numerous research that it made up of 60% of total return.

So how can one conclude that dividend destroy the value of the company?

Unless if the company has no free cash flows and resort to issuing more shares or borrow money (already in high debt) to pay dividends which it can't afford to.

it is a matter of dividend policy and capital allocation. If a company gets a lot of free cash flows from its ordinary business, management can do a few things with it,

1) Gives out as dividends
2) buy back shares
3) invest in new ventures
4) Pay down debts

Management should only buy back shares if they are selling very cheap. If the share is fairly valued or overvalued, why buy back? What is the point of public listing then?

Most of the time, as shown in research, company doing merger and acquisition destroy value. So no. 3 not necessary great, in fact often it is bad.

If company has a capital structure of 10% debt and 90% equity, or even 40% debt, and company produces a lot of free cash flows, why want to pay down debts? Cost of debt is cheaper and it is tax deductible, or there is a tax shield. As long as the debt is not too much, it is better to use it. It is also much cheap than cost of equity.

In fact, if a company produces a lot of FCF, it may be better to do recapitalization, get more debts and distribute cash as special dividends to shareholder. Again no one-size fits all. Some managers, especially owner shareholders, they are conservative, which is also not a bad thing.

Distribute that excess cash to shareholders if company has no good use for it.

See candies distribute almost all FCF to shareholders every year. Buffett use this cash to invest in other things.

I like to do my own things with that cash dividends, whether to reinvet in the company, or look for better opportunities, or simply enjoy it. How long more can we live?

Posted by (US/CHN trade war doesn't matter) Philip > May 19, 2019 6:01 PM | Report Abuse
Your implied it that way. I may have received the info wrongly then. Apologies. I believe a company should only give out a dividend if it is under to use the money more efficiently than the shareholders. If the interest rates are high, using capital on debt reduction is far better than dividends. If the share price is far far lower than book value or peer value, buybacks are worth much more than dividends.
The main takeaway is that everything must have a context for the action. Why must a private placement be needed? Why not explain clearly to shareholders and do a rights issue? Why give out a dividend if you need to raise cash later via pp with extra 10% discount to raise money?
>>>>>
Did I say if a company doesn't give dividend, it is a negative signal?
What is wrong with receiving dividend every year from investing in a stock?


When I say you are a good man man because you donate a lot of money to charity. Does it mean I imply that you are a bad man if you don't?

Anyway, it is a matter of capital allocation. If a company gets a lot of free cash flows from its ordinary business, management can do a few things with it,

1) Gives out as dividends
2) buy back shares
3) invest in new ventures
4) Pay down debts

Management should only buy back shares if they are selling very cheap. If the share is fairly valued or overvalued, why buy back? What is the point of public listing then?

Most of the time, as shown in research, company doing merger and acquisition destroy value. So no. 3 not necessary great.

If company has a capital structure of 10% debt and 90% equity, or even 40% debt, and company produces a lot of free cash flows, why want to pay down debts? Cost of debt is much cheaper than cost of equity.

In fact, if a company produces a lot of FCF, it may be better to do recapitalization, get more debts and distribute cash as special dividends to shareholder.

Distribute that excess cash to shareholders if company has no use for it.

See candies distribute almost all FCF to shareholders every year. Buffett use this cash to invest in other things.

Posted by (US/CHN trade war doesn't matter) Philip > May 19, 2019 5:15 PM | Report Abuse
I see. I own 2 shares of class A brk. It has never given me a dividend. Does that mean it is a negative signal, the management is unwilling to share the profits of the company? I hope not.


Did I say if a company doesn't give dividend, it is a negative signal?

What is wrong with receiving dividend every year from investing in a stock?

Posted by (US/CHN trade war doesn't matter) Philip > May 18, 2019 7:50 PM | Report Abuse
Malaysian investors are weird. They look down on companies that do buybacks and overly value dividend payout. They should understand context, buybacks when the intrinsic share value is low and debt paring vs dividend payout (or even borrowing money to pay a dividend) is key in raising long term value.

In investing, there is no one size fits all.

Buyback shares when the share price is undervalued is definitely good for the company and the shareholders. However, not all managers buy back shares because they are undervalued, but rather for their interest such as jacking up share price because they own a lot of shares or share options. I prefer management buys more shares with their own money.

The very basic of the capital market is investors provide capital for company to do business, and the investors got return in term of regular dividends, from the free cash flows of the company, not from borrowings.

Dividend is never a bad thing in investing. It is a testimonial that the company is doing well, that the management is willing to share the profits of the company, a positive signal. Dividend is hard cash which investors can use it as they like; to buy more shares of the company, or other more promising companies, or spend it to enjoy their fruits.

Posted by (US/CHN trade war doesn't matter) Philip > May 18, 2019 7:50 PM | Report Abuse
private placements and rights issues are never a good sign, no matter how good the marketing and storytelling can be.
Doing any private placements or rights issue when the market is challenging is never doing the right thing by the investors. Management has to give big discounts to raise cash, and in the end the ones that lose out are the owners and minority shareholders of the company.

I agree with you mostly.

Sometimes cash calls are required for some good causes. Getting bank loans and bond issues is a better option as cost of debts is lower than cost of equity, and there is no dilution of existing shareholders by private placements.

Rights issues is not so bad when cash is required. However, private placement is simpler, faster with less regulations. If the company needs the cash fast, and cash will be used productively, it is not too bad after all.

Thanks for the correction. Drank too much pinot noir. I have corrected the title.

pjseow,

Yours is a fantastic return in a long period of time. Congrats. Anyone following your fundamental approach in investing will do well.

I remember reading many of your comments in my threads. They are the comments which motivate me. Thank you very much.

Note my return of 6.3% is for 5 quarters from January 2018 to May 2019, and not this 4 months. This has been a tough period for Bursa.

Posted by qqq3 > May 18, 2019 2:55 PM | Report Abuse
kc....I have 200% gain in a few years because I take risk....I don't go around selling my services because it is all about risk....Its always risk - reward......

200% return from where?

From here?
10/8/2018 5/17/2019
Sendai 0.8 0.47 -41.3%
Serba 4.15 4.07 -1.9%
Pmetal 5.15 4.31 -16.3%

Or here?
10/31/2018 5/17/2019
KESM 12 7.51 -37.4%
Layhong 0.4 0.455 13.8%
Seacara 0.28 0.22 -21.4%
D&O 0.89 0.62 -30.3%
Elsoft 1.29 0.84 -35.0%
Hibiscus 1.12 1.09 -2.7%


Or here?
18/5/19 Return
Jaks 1.80 0.72 -60%
Sendai 1.40 0.43 -69%

Sell your service? What ""service""? In Jalan Alor?

Posted by qqq3 > May 17, 2019 1:18 PM | Report Abuse
kc.....there were a few years when small caps gave superior returns, fantastic returns, 2012 to 2016 ( thereabouts)...plenty of small caps at PE below 10 and one by one everyone of them began to perform.
golden era for u.....but not every day is a Sunday.....so , now we are in 2019, so how?

Yes, if you chose the right shares like what I could do, many of them are small or mid caps, you made a lot of money from 2012 to 2016, and 2017 included, and even more, much more in the region of 35%-40%.

How is that compared with Jaks and Sendai you had been shouting sailang and margin during the same period from RM1.80+ and RM1.40+ respectively? You lost your pants and also made many people lost their pants, including the so-called super investor.

For 2018 until now, my ten stocks selected still in positive territory of +6.3% compared to loss of FBMKCI of -8.2% and the small cap index of -24.1%.

Compared with what you posted in i3investor in this few years with all return tanked like below,

10/8/2018 5/17/2019
Sendai 0.8 0.47 -41.3%
Serba 4.15 4.07 -1.9%
Pmetal 5.15 4.31 -16.3%


10/31/2018 5/17/2019
KESM 12 7.51 -37.4%
Layhong 0.4 0.455 13.8%
Seacara 0.28 0.22 -21.4%
D&O 0.89 0.62 -30.3%
Elsoft 1.29 0.84 -35.0%
Hibiscus 1.12 1.09 -2.7%

Av -19.2%


So how?

Posted by qqq3 > May 17, 2019 12:43 PM | Report Abuse
I am a professional, remember?

Sure you must be a professional as below,


Posted by Sslee > May 13, 2019 8:50 AM | Report Abuse
Yes KYY had make his biggest investment mistake because he was hoodwinked/hypnotized by quack accountant into sailang and Margin Finance into JAKs and SENDAI.
So Please stay far away from quack accountant and do not underestimate his hypnotize power as I see many people in this forum still call quack accountant Sifu and ask for his opinion. Only I and KCChong call this good for nothing quack accountant as fake accountant, snake-oil salesman, a fraudster, a backstabber, a bootlicker, an ass-kisser, a shameless manipulator, King of PLP, King of double talk, King of backstabber, King of poison slanderer, King of jealously, King of low life, King of bullshitting and talk cock, King of dishonest, despicable, distasteful, disgusting and evil.

Posted by qqq3 > May 17, 2019 12:38 PM | Report Abuse
Posted by qqq3 > Oct 8, 2018 09:43 PM | Report Abuse
Sendai is very good to me...I am sitting on 15% profits, not selling yet until I come back from holidays.
=========
despite what I said, I cannot resist taking profits soon after I wrote..........see, I am a trader at heart.......

What shall someone base on?

The records of what you wrote in the public forum, or shat you said (to who?)?

Look at the stocks you have chosen below and their return now below as shown all over in i3investor,

10/8/2018 5/17/2019
Sendai 0.8 0.47 -41.3%
Serba 4.15 4.07 -1.9%
Pmetal 5.15 4.31 -16.3%


10/31/2018 5/17/2019
KESM 12 7.51 -37.4%
Layhong 0.4 0.455 13.8%
Seacara 0.28 0.22 -21.4%
D&O 0.89 0.62 -30.3%
Elsoft 1.29 0.84 -35.0%
Hibiscus 1.12 1.09 -2.7%

Av -19.2%


Made 200% from RM100k to RM300k? Every share tanked!

What have you done to those touted by you to sailang and margin Sendai from RM1.40 in the last two years?

You better go to temple and kneel down for days to repent!

Posted by qqq3 > May 17, 2019 11:53 AM | Report Abuse
sendai is a contrarian play...contrarian play not easy , never easy but my investment thesis intact...and more accurate than your analysis of sendai.........I just needed a bit more time.

So what is your ""investment thesis"" for Sendai? Can make a post on it ah?

You need time?

You have already give two years but your Sendai price have dropped from RM1.40 to now just 43%. How many % loss?

70% loss my God!

Posted by qqq3 > May 17, 2019 11:53 AM | Report Abuse
seekers of quality no need sendai or dayang in their portfolio....admittedly I have sendai at 52........

Posted by qqq3 > Oct 8, 2018 09:43 PM | Report Abuse
Sendai is very good to me...I am sitting on 15% profits, not selling yet until I come back from holidays.
Pmetal and Serba.....any drop just buy la.....sure make money one if keep long enough.......
not talking about horse before cannon but talking about the future.......


On October 8 2018, these were the prices

10/8/2018 5/17/2019
Sendai 0.8 0.47 -41.3%
Serba 4.15 4.07 -1.9%
Pmetal 5.15 4.31 -16.3%

How to calculate that your profit was 15% then when Sendai was 80 sen then?

80/52-1=15%? What kind of ""accountant"" you are?

So how much more Pmetal and Serba you have bought after their share prices dropped from Oct 8 2018?

How to triple your investment when every share you touted in i3investor lost money as shown above?

Posted by qqq3 > May 17, 2019 10:42 AM | Report Abuse
kc......
SCGM....95
Dayang ...115
have I convinced you to focus more on quality and less on over/under valutions?
more business sense and less rear view drive?


Dayang? Did I recommend you to buy, or someone else?

How do you compare the quality of Dayang and Sendai in this post? One with high return on capital and persistent good cash flows in Dayang, and one with return on capital less than half of its capital, and negative free cash flows every year until its debts ballooned to billion, and never get paid the work done for its major shareholder.

Do I talk about the business of the company or the share price movement in this post?

Don't understand the above?

What a stupid self-proclaimed ""accountant""?

The more you quack the more you expose your stupidity. Stupid quack!

Posted by qqq3 > May 16, 2019 4:31 PM | Report Abuse
kc...where is the lie ? what lie?
he bot some at $ 1.31...and subsequently sold some at below that.......got scared of trade wars.........very common behavior.

Posted by vespa > May 16, 2019 4:38 PM | Report Abuse
if you are subscribe to Shareinvestor it has top 20 shareholding; KYY had sold out just after April 22

Posted by qqq3 > May 8, 2019 11:38 PM | Report Abuse
at $ 1.50.....I told KYY , selling Dayang at between $ 1.60 to $ 1.80 is called smart. I made that comment not once but several times.........He wrote back to say he cannot be so dishonest as to sell at $ 1.70 when he has just been writing about it....To me, it is money or honor, KYY chose honor.

Posted by qqq3
“ps....KYY just whatsapp me says he bought 300,000 lots Dayang at $ 1.31................u jealous or what? KYY and I cannot exchange whatsapp?
09/05/2019 7:14 PM”
16/05/2019 2:23 PM

Posted by qqq3 > May 16, 2019 9:59 AM | Report Abuse
but I think u need help......KYY selling Dayang a few days ago is KYY business .....why u say u don't understand?
the price today $ 1.16.....he says he sell some to avoid force selling , just in case....why cannot meh?
must ask your permission first?


No lah,he can do whatever he likes lah, but can explain your comments below ah? Are you accusing your master a dishonest man? Please lah, he is a well known person in Malaysia with reputation. Don't damage his reputation please!


Posted by qqq3 > May 8, 2019 11:38 PM | Report Abuse
at $ 1.50.....I told KYY , selling Dayang at between $ 1.60 to $ 1.80 is called smart. I made that comment not once but several times.........He wrote back to say he cannot be so dishonest as to sell at $ 1.70 when he has just been writing about it....To me, it is money or honor, KYY chose honor.

Posted by qqq3
“ps....KYY just whatsapp me says he bought 300,000 lots Dayang at $ 1.31................u jealous or what? KYY and I cannot exchange whatsapp?
09/05/2019 7:14 PM”

Posted by qqq3 > May 14, 2019 10:27 PM | Report Abuse

Posted by Heavenly PUNTER Research IB > May 14, 2019 10:11 PM | Report Abuse
Unker Kc, Thanks, I still have a lot more to learn... Sometimes I still check my price quite often, but I am trying very hard to cut down the amount of time on it. At the very least I don't get emotional when Donald Trump starts tweeting, I think that's an improvement compared to December 2018!
===========
it all depends whether your portfolio is quality or non quality shares..........
What happens when there is trouble in the horizon? Flight to safety is the first reaction when there is trouble in the horizon. That is why only small cap index is affected and quality shares hardly affected.
Always a balancing act between risk - reward.


Does it look like this young man needs any advice from you? Read his posts and comments, although he is a third of your age, in investing, he is ten thousand miles ahead of you, in knowledge, mindset and return!