Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 11:40 | Report Abuse

Hello first how u got u receivables 1052m???

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 11:46 | Report Abuse

Contract work in progress 398.6
Receivables 653.0

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 11:48 | Report Abuse

KCCHONGNZ..... AIYO!! U DONT KNOW NUT ABT ACCOUNT MAN!!!!!!

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 11:51 | Report Abuse

So what is the problem? contract work in progress is money spent, but yet to receive from clients. Never mind about the term lah. Relax, no need to put so many exclamation marks. Contract work in progress is also something like that, don't know when and how much is collectible.

Any more mistakes found?

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 11:52 | Report Abuse

KCCHONGNZ... WRONG! TRY AGAIN....

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 11:54 | Report Abuse

What is wrong? Don't just say its wrong.

Posted by matrix109 > 2013-09-09 11:54 | Report Abuse

Yesss,, that is whta I have in mind too.

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 11:58 | Report Abuse

Ok... FYI.. contract work in progress is actually stocks ok... tat is.. already got d contract at d moment building d order n until completed can bil u yet...

may b u r more familiar wil manufacturing account.... stock comprises raw material work in progress finished goods....

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:00 | Report Abuse

all cos hv stocks... how can u out of d blue jz doubt it cannot b collected when it is not even billed?

Posted by matrix109 > 2013-09-09 12:04 | Report Abuse

Anyway, I hv some reservation for this counter untill this company restructure it position. My first jumped in was wrong untill I made a study about this counter. Still this counter possible to go to PN17???

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:06 | Report Abuse

tis contract work in progress... plus additions from jul to sep... wil likely b d revenue for d qtr 3..... get it?

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 12:07 | Report Abuse

Let's not argue about the term. The quality of these assets, receivables, contract work in progress, inventories, intangibles, inventories, PPE are not that great because unlike cash, shares investment biological assets, land held for development etc which are good quality assets.

Any other comments or mistakes of what I got for the shit for KNM?

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:09 | Report Abuse

terms r important... otherwise jz show one figure as current assets la...

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 12:12 | Report Abuse

ok ok ok, terms are important. Any other comments about my criticisms on KNM below:

Posted by kcchongnz > Sep 9, 2013 11:27 AM | Report Abuse X

Let's talk about its present marked-to-market shit, the balance sheet just announced a few days ago.

Here is the borrowing condition of KNM:

Short term debt 738.2
Long term debt 135.1
Cash 137.6
Net borrowings 735.7

Wow, still got 736 m of net loan, equal to a net debt per share of 51 sen.

It has a total equity of 1898m, huge. But look at the quality of the assets which makes up the equity:

Inventories 75.2
Contract work in progress 398.6
Receivables 653.0
Total 1126.8

Intangible assets 1310.9
PPE 847.8
Total 2158.7

Wow, 3285m of its assets are low quality assets; intangibles is already 1311m, and receivables of 1052m. Don't know how much will be eventually collected. 848m in PPE? How much is the market value?

Mind you, this is its present shit, not the historical shit of a few years ago!

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:14 | Report Abuse

kccchongnz... first u dont know account... now u show u lack operational knowledge too... my man things need time to b processed ok... u cant bil today n expect to b paid tommoro!!!! tis is d only way for a co not to hv receivables.. bil today paid immediately... knm is kacang putih biz.. get paid immediately

in knm case d processing time takes even a bit longer cos works done need to b tested n certified ok..

Posted by matrix109 > 2013-09-09 12:15 | Report Abuse

Wooowwww like this can go to PN4

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:17 | Report Abuse

so 1126.8 is good... u shdnt doubt without justification.. jz close ur eyes n shoot

Posted by mfbs > 2013-09-09 12:18 | Report Abuse

Yes, aggree with esdm... ys1?

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:20 | Report Abuse

seeing tat u simply shoot.... better u tell wit justification first wat is wrong wit d ppe??

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 12:23 | Report Abuse

ok ok ok, I don't know account. I am not an accountant mah. Don't hit so hard lah.

But I do know something about receivables because I was a corporate person before. Receivables are what you think your clients owed you. You may claim this and that are additional works, variation orders etc because you think it is beyond the contracts. You may also accuse clients delay you want to claim extra money etc etc. But do your clients and their consultants agree with you for all these extra claims.

Why do I have doubts? My question is why the receivables so high? It is even more than the annual revenue and consistently year in year out. Why? Doesn't that warrant some doubts in you as a shareholder of KNM? Yeah, you may not. Good luck on you.

Posted by matrix109 > 2013-09-09 12:26 | Report Abuse

That "RECEIVABLE" is only for jockers lahh..wait for sometime and see its performance again.

Posted by asriruslan > 2013-09-09 12:28 | Report Abuse

resistance at 0.42 if can break this knm can go more higher> watchout

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:28 | Report Abuse

revenue for 2012: 2,372,264,000
Receivables 653,000,000

kindly calculate n tell how many days......

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 12:28 | Report Abuse

PPE? Simply shoot? Did I? I just present you what is it the balance shit. How much do you think is the realizable value of the PPE? What is the alternative use if others buy them?

I didn't even give a figure. I just said they are not good quality assets because they are not like cash, land etc.

Posted by Alex Chan > 2013-09-09 12:28 | Report Abuse

still believers out there....dangerously low on cash flow, might enter PN17...finito

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:38 | Report Abuse

ppe r there to generate income... without ppe how to produde d goods for sale??

fyi.. nowadays if a ppe cannot b used anymore... mind u not bcos it has broken down.. but jz bcos d items it produces hv no more markets.. its value has to b written down... tat is if futute sale from it is 0 its book value is now 0..

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 12:45 | Report Abuse

Posted by eSdM > Sep 9, 2013 12:28 PM | Report Abuse
revenue for 2012: 2,372,264,000
Receivables 653,000,000
kindly calculate n tell how many days......

This one I know how to calculate but you don't have to test me. Just get right to the point. But I don't want to waste time calculating that.

Now my quiz now.

Fixed assets 2198m
Net working capital 542m
Invested capital 2740m
Profit before tax 68m

Use a total capital of 2740m but made just 68m. What kind of business is that?

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:48 | Report Abuse

kccchongnz... so d receivables is how many days???

not tat many days isnt it??

FYI cannot use quaterly sales figures to calculate the receivables number of days.... must use ANNUAL sales....

hope it is ur eyes failing u.... not one more account lesson learned from me again...

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:50 | Report Abuse

jz 100 days... abt 3 months... where got like wat u said...

Why do I have doubts? My question is why the receivables so high? It is even more than the annual revenue and consistently year in year out. Why? Doesn't that warrant some doubts in you as a shareholder of KNM? Yeah, you may not. Good luck on you.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 12:53 | Report Abuse

I don't need to learn accounting for you. Definitely not you.

How many days? Why not look at it this way. KNM made a pretax profit of just 68m last year. but the receivables is 653m, ten times more than what it earns one year! Some more there is this work in progress also tied up the money of 400m! Total money tied up in receivables and work in progress of more than 1 b, and for 68m pretax profit. So great ah?

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:55 | Report Abuse

is it?? but i saw so many account errors on ur part leh.....

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 12:58 | Report Abuse

Got meh? Where? Besides the arguable receivables and work in progress.

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 12:59 | Report Abuse

now u want to move away from account.....

n from knm abt to close anytime now.. according to u abt 15 minutes ago... to jz knm biz is not so good now....

knm situation is improving by d minutes based on wat u say.... long even b4 d release of d qtr 3 result...

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 13:00 | Report Abuse

On the other hand, if I "learn' accounting from you, I would have followed your reasoning and buy big in KNM. Just don't know where it will lead me to.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 13:03 | Report Abuse

No, I am not moving away from account. So where are "so many account errors on ur part leh.....".

Please elaborate

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 13:06 | Report Abuse

I simply shoot? Where? Aren't the figures correct? You haven't disputed them woh besides the arguable receivables and work in progress.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 13:08 | Report Abuse

On the other hand, I think you simply shoot woh. See your statement below. Where and what and why you said that ah?

"knm situation is improving by d minutes based on wat u say.... long even b4 d release of d qtr 3 result..."

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 13:42 | Report Abuse

i hv jz covered two of ur bals.. n both also u hv errors... BIG errors

others also hv errors but i hv no time to go thru wit u la...

suffice to say thr r auditors to check d accounts to make sure it is ok

Posted by johnny cash > 2013-09-09 13:48 | Report Abuse

this company TALKS a lot to jack up the price,, by then they will be selling n the public will be buying..so here again the public falls into the mind trap play.. why SC are not looking at this play,, are their eyes blind?? very weird ha

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 13:52 | Report Abuse

kcchongnz On the other hand, I think you simply shoot woh. See your statement below. Where and what and why you said that ah?

"knm situation is improving by d minutes based on wat u say.... long even b4 d release of d qtr 3 result..."
09/09/2013 13:08

HAHA... ISNT IT TRUE....

AT FIRST.. U SAID... RECEIVABLES WORK IN PROGRESS CANNOT COLLECT... N SINCE CANNOT COLLECT HOW IS KNM GOING TO PAY ITS DEBTS... IF CANNOT PAY MEAN CLOSE SHOP LA KNM...

LATER U CHANGED N... U JZ SAID... KNM BIZ IS NO GOOD......

ISNT TAT FROM ABT TO CLOSE SHOP.. TO JZ D BIZ IS NO GOOD... ALL ACCORDING TO U IN ALL OF 15 MINUTES

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 13:55 | Report Abuse

Posted by eSdM > Sep 9, 2013 01:42 PM | Report Abuse

i hv jz covered two of ur bals.. n both also u hv errors... BIG errors

BIG ERRORS? ERRORS ARE SMALL THINGS. MISTAKES ARE BIG THINGS. AIYAH, YOU ARE JUST LIKE THE GENERAL (READ WHAT JONNY CASH WROTE ABOVE). TALK TALK TALK AND NEVER SHOW ANYTHING.

others also hv errors but i hv no time to go thru wit u la...

WAH YOU GOT NO TIME TO GO THROUGH ALREADY KNOW THERE ARE OTHER ERRORS.

suffice to say thr r auditors to check d accounts to make sure it is ok

WHAT IS THIS STATEMENT FOR?

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 14:07 | Report Abuse

I HV SEEN IT N I KNOW THR R ERRORS.... N SINCE U DONT WANT TO LEARN N I HV NO TIME.... JZ LEAVE THM AS THY R.



suffice to say thr r auditors to check d accounts to make sure it is ok
WHAT IS THIS STATEMENT FOR?



??????? ISNT ITS PURPOSE OBVIOUS??!!
ANYWAY WAT I M SAYING IS THR R AUDITORS WHO AUDIT KNM ACCOUNTS TO MAKE SURE D BALANCES R FAIR LA... N KNM ACCOUNT NO SIMPLY SHOOT... LIKE U....

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-09-09 14:28 | Report Abuse

eSdM, let us take this argument between you and me as nothing personal. You indeed know about accounting. Neither I know nothing about it although I am not an accountant. Since you want to leave it as it is, it is fine with me. But you just can't say I simply shoot, unless you justify what you say.

But I think it is good that those people here have some different views about KNM and judge by themselves if they want to invest in KNM or not. For those who have no knowledge about financial statements, if they wish, they may learn something about reading and interpreting financial statements here.

I would take this as a fruitful discussion.

Posted by eSdM > 2013-09-09 14:33 | Report Abuse

Yes.. absolutely nothing personal.. nice talking to u as u r quite a gentleman..

Posted by asriruslan > 2013-09-09 14:36 | Report Abuse

this time knm will take action watchout>everything like in order

Posted by asriruslan > 2013-09-09 14:40 | Report Abuse

less talk more action is better

Posted by asriruslan > 2013-09-09 14:43 | Report Abuse

the important thing is if they want to play or not this counter>if they want to push nothing cant stop>market is going uptrend again for the moment

Posted by asriruslan > 2013-09-09 14:44 | Report Abuse

buy at 0.41

Posted by matrix109 > 2013-09-09 14:48 | Report Abuse

Actually, if they paly play this counter and they actually know how much their shares are worth at. But it seems to me , they will paly play and chow..and leave at 31cents and support it by them (the company)how about that?

Posted by asriruslan > 2013-09-09 14:54 | Report Abuse

the range they play now is 0.39-0.415 if market still up knm will follow>that all