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China/CCP bashing, nothing could be further from the truth.
China/CCP bashing, nothing could be further from the truth. What Charlie Munger has to say about China and CCP?
Charlie Munger on the rise of China
26 Dec 2020
Charlie Munger did
an online interview for the Caltech Distinguished Alumnus Award in December 2020. He talked about China’s remarkable rise (e.g., lifting hundreds of millions of people from poverty):
an online interview for the Caltech Distinguished Alumnus Award in December 2020. He talked about China’s remarkable rise (e.g., lifting hundreds of millions of people from poverty):
Charlie: The other thing that’s really remarkable. You take the last 30 years of China. They have had real economic growth at a rate for 30 years that no big country has ever had before in the history of the world. And who did that? A bunch of Chinese communists. Now, that is really remarkable. So if you’re studying finance, you’ve got a lot of strange things to account for.
The Chinese story is the damnedest thing that ever happened to a big country in terms of economics. No other big country ever got ahead that fast for that long.
Who would have guessed that a bunch of communist Chinese run by one party would have the best economic record the world has ever seen? Of course it’s extreme. And I think it proves that it doesn’t… We Americans would like to think that our free expression and allowing all kinds of opinion, and all kinds of criticism of the government is totally an essential part of the economy. And what the Chinese have proved is you can have a screamingly successful economy with a fairly controlling government.
All the government has to do is create a lot of [Adam] Smithian capitalism. If you do that, having a sort of a controlling one-party government doesn’t matter. That’s not a fashionable thing to say, but I think it’s true.
He also mentioned China on his closing remarks:
Moderator: What are you most curious about in the next 30 to 40 years?
Charlie: Well, having been an investor for so long, I’m of course interested in these weird present conditions and these weird economic conditions where they’re printing money like crazy and so forth. And of course that’s very interesting.
And I’m interested in the fact that the world has come so far in having these undeveloped countries get ahead so fast like China. Now I compare it with India, which has a way worse economic record, even though they got more of our political institutions. You know, they got more free speech in India, and a way worse economic achievement. I think the economic development of the modern world is very interesting. It’s a very interesting subject.
Update — February 2021
In Daily Journal’s 2021 AGM, Charlie was asked again about China. Here are his remarks:
Question: My question concerns China. In 1860, GDP per capita in China was 600. In 1978, the year Deng Xiaoping took over, it was 300. Today, it hovers around 9500. Never before in the history of mankind have we seen such a rapid eradication of poverty, pulling approximately 800 million people out of destitution. You are on record as a zealous fan of the Chinese work ethic and Confucian value system. As we can see from the deteriorating U.S. relationship with China, the Western world does not understand China. What can we do to increase knowledge, understanding, and appreciation of the Chinese civilization?
Charlie Munger: Well, it’s natural for people to think their own civilization and their own nation are better than everybody else. But everybody can’t be better than everybody else.
You’re right. China’s economic record among the big nations is the best that ever existed in the history of the world. And that’s very interesting.
A lot of people assume that since England led the Industrial Revolution and had free speech early that free speech is required to have a booming economy as prescribed by Adam Smith. But the Chinese have proved that you don’t need free speech to have a wonderful economy. They just copied Adam Smith and left out the free speech and it worked fine for them.
As a matter of fact, it’s not clear to me that China would have done better if they’d copied every aspect of English civilization. I think they would have come out worse because their position was so dire and the poverty was so extreme, they needed very extreme methods to get out of the fix they were in. So I think what China has done was probably right for China and that we shouldn’t be so pompous as to be telling the Chinese they ought to behave like us because we like ourselves and our system. It’s entirely possible that our system is right for us and their system is right for them.
Question: Mr. Munger is a champion of Chinese stocks. How concerned is he about Chinese government interference as seen recently with Ant Financial, Alibaba, and Mr. Jack Ma. What, for example, is to stop the Chinese government from simply deciding one day to nationalize BYD?
Charlie Munger: Well, I consider that very unlikely. And, I think Jack Ma was very arrogant to be telling the Chinese government how dumb they were, how stupid their policies were, and so forth. Considering their system, that is not what he should have been doing.
I think the Chinese have behaved very shrewdly in managing their economy and they’ve gotten better results than we have in managing our economy. I think that that will probably continue.
Sure, we all love the kind of civilization we have. I’m not saying I wanted to live in China. I prefer the United States. But I do admire what the Chinese have done. How can you not? Nobody else has ever taken a big country out of poverty so fast and so on.
What I see in China now just staggers me. There are factories in China that are just absolutely full of robots and are working beautifully.
They’re no longer using peasant girls to beat the brains out of our little shoe companies in America. They are joining the modern world very rapidly and they’re getting very skillful at operating.
You just need to open your mind to let in the sound of peace, love and forgiveness to fill your heart. May this season of forgiveness bring peace to the world.
Selamat Hari Raya Idul Fitri. Mohon Maaf Lahir dan Batin.
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Discussions
4 people like this. Showing 50 of 148 comments
it is in first 30 years, China health care, education, literacy, housing reach to every village, every county...moral education, unity, patriotism, socialism
2021-05-14 08:20
to be fair, also must thank Nixon and Carter who build bridges..... it is very difficult to grow under sanction when foundation, the size not strong enough
2021-05-14 08:23
1860, GDP per capita in China was 600. In 1978, the year Deng Xiaoping took over, it was 300. Today, it hovers around 9500.
If not for Deng China is a failed state. That the real history. No one is beyond criticism but you need to do it in the right way.
“Everyone should be respected as an individual, but no one idolized.” – Albert Einstein
I just reread the chapter 28: THINK BEFORE YOU CRITICISE. From the book’ “How to win friends and influence people.” by Dale Carnegie.
The important message from this chapter, “History will be kind, if people had learnt early the bitterness experience that sharp criticisms and rebukes almost invariably end in futility. Criticism is dangerous, because it wounds a person’s precious pride, hurt his sense of dignity and worst arouse resentment and make him strive to justify himself and take his revenge/vindication at any cost.”
President Obama had learnt too late he should not ridicule and humiliate an invited guest Donald Trump publicly back in 2011 White House Correspondents’ Association Dinner. And Hillary Clinton strong condemnation, “Putin as ex-KGB agent has no soul” Imagine what will Putin feel, when he is the head of state of Russia? Very importantly what is Hillary Clinton thinking, when she is inspired to run for the Office of President of the United States?
2021-05-14 09:01
https://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/Sslee_blog/2021-02-28-story-h1541943429-Malaysia_badly_needed_Education_Reform.jsp
Watch Deng Xiaoping at History's Crossroads/Inflection Points (历史转折中的邓小平) a 2014 TV biopic series based on the life of Deng Xiaoping.
2021-05-14 09:12
From Ai Weiwei twitter comment:
刚结束的伦敦G7外长会议，先被新华社形容是“岳不群”风格，中国“战狼画手”再补刀，把G7外长合照改成八国联军，更再次在印度的疫情伤口上洒盐
“帝国主义亡我之心不死”、“总有刁民来害朕”的心态，就是国格吗？
2021-05-14 10:28
Michelle Obama‘s famous phrase — “When they go low, we go high” —
“‘Going high’ doesn’t mean you don’t feel the hurt, or you’re not entitled to an emotion,” she explained. “It means that your response has to reflect the solution. It shouldn’t come from a place of anger or vengefulness.
Stoop to their low level is easy but it do not solve the problem.
Responding to a dog whistle with a dog whistle is the exact opposite of what you’d teach your child to do.
2021-05-14 11:00
Usa use to go high many years back, now it go very very low mah!
Posted by Sslee > May 14, 2021 11:00 AM | Report Abuse
Michelle Obama‘s famous phrase — “When they go low, we go high” —
“‘Going high’ doesn’t mean you don’t feel the hurt, or you’re not entitled to an emotion,” she explained. “It means that your response has to reflect the solution. It shouldn’t come from a place of anger or vengefulness.
Stoop to their low level is easy but it do not solve the problem.
Responding to a dog whistle with a dog whistle is the exact opposite of what you’d teach your child to do.
2021-05-14 12:51
forget michelle obama, forget obama, forget Trump , forget Biden...these are politicians.
want to learn useful stuffs...want to learn about the future....learn from philosophers, historians, futurologists, political scientists, university professors.
and on China , pay attention to Martin Jacques, Kishore Mahbubani,
China is not just rising, China is returning to the top.
2021-05-14 20:13
of course any thing about the future is just a prediction. If there is a war, things can still go wrong.
Predictions are just what is logical
2021-05-14 20:16
“However strong it may grow, China will never seek hegemony, expansion or a sphere of influence, nor will China ever engage in an arms race,” Xi said at the opening ceremony of the annual Boao Forum for Asia in the Chinese province of Hainan.
Xi also claimed, not for the first time, that China is a champion for globalization and the multilateral trading system, saying that international rules should not be set by just one or a few nations.
Without naming any countries, Xi said big nations should behave in a manner “befitting their status and with a greater sense of responsibility.”
He also spoke against a “Cold War” mentality and “ideological confrontation,”
Last month, Biden said China has “an overall goal to become the leading country, the wealthiest country in the world and the most powerful country in the world.” The U.S. president said he will not let that happen under his watch.
2021-05-14 20:52
I think, in order to protect china citizens, china should quickly develop its militarily capability as a deterrent, the fastest approach is China should beefed up its nuclear weapons arnsneal & increased its capability to deliver the weapon quickly & fast until it reaches at least USA equivalent level loh!
This is the only way China can prevent constant bullying by the west mah!
Posted by Sslee > May 14, 2021 8:52 PM | Report Abuse
“However strong it may grow, China will never seek hegemony, expansion or a sphere of influence, nor will China ever engage in an arms race,” Xi said at the opening ceremony of the annual Boao Forum for Asia in the Chinese province of Hainan.
Xi also claimed, not for the first time, that China is a champion for globalization and the multilateral trading system, saying that international rules should not be set by just one or a few nations.
Without naming any countries, Xi said big nations should behave in a manner “befitting their status and with a greater sense of responsibility.”
He also spoke against a “Cold War” mentality and “ideological confrontation,”
Last month, Biden said China has “an overall goal to become the leading country, the wealthiest country in the world and the most powerful country in the world.” The U.S. president said he will not let that happen under his watch.
2021-05-14 21:51
want to learn useful stuffs...want to learn about the future....learn from philosophers, historians, futurologists, political scientists, university professors.
earn from western media sure wrong. Journalists, politicians mainstream media sells sensations, not knowledge., not insights.
2021-05-14 23:56
Posted by Sslee > May 14, 2021 8:52 PM | Report Abuse
Last month, Biden said China has “an overall goal to become the leading country, the wealthiest country in the world and the most powerful country in the world.” The U.S. president said he will not let that happen under his watch.
*******
So it's never gonna happen at all. Becos the next US prez after Biden is gonna say that too. And the next one after that one. And so on & so forth.
2021-05-15 00:16
There is little doubt Xi is very popular in China and very competent. I don't see any weakness in him.
China got loads and loads of very capable leaders.
2021-05-15 01:55
President Xi once said, "success does not have to come from me." I understand this phrase to be about a sense of responsibility. It’s about taking responsibility for the future, for tomorrow, for the next generation. Many of the world's problems today, including China's, can only be solved by innovation. However, for real innovation to happen, no one will show you the way, and someone must shoulder that responsibility, because innovation is bound to make mistakes. But the question is not how not to make mistakes, but whether we can perfect and correct them after making mistakes and persistently innovate. To make risk-free innovation is to stifle innovation, and there is no risk-free innovation in this world. Oftentimes, managing risk down to zero is the biggest risk.
2021-05-15 08:24
Extract from Robert Kuok Memoir: “In its 5,000-year history, I doubt that China has had as enlightened a group of leaders as during the past 30 years. They wanted their country to grow, and their people to prosper. Few leaders today compare with China’s in terms of true patriotism, selfless devotion to duty, and complete willingness to dedicate their lives to the causes of nation-building and raising the peoples’ standard of living.
In my business travels around China, I often came across incompetent or bigoted officials. Nearly every time I had a major tussle with one, or I met a dubious vice governor or mayor, I would come back and, in my judgmental way, tell my colleagues, “How can that man run such-and-such a city?” And sure enough, the next time I visited the place, say a year later, the man had been removed and a better man was in his place. I began to note to myself and to others that in Southeast Asia, a bad egg gets promoted; in China, a bad egg is removed.
2021-05-15 08:42
China is on an uptrend because of its people take responsibility and leaders lead.
US is on a downtrend because of its leader mislead and people blame each other but themselve.
So if you are an investor who do you want to invest in?
2021-05-15 08:51
Sslee > May 15, 2021 8:51 AM | Report Abuse
China is on an uptrend because of its people take responsibility and leaders lead.
US is on a downtrend because of its leader mislead and people blame each other but themselve.
So if you are an investor who do you want to invest in?
==============
not so simple.
First two sentence surely correct. ...but investing not so simple.
First u have to know that for China people and country come first and stock market not so much. Its capitalism with Chinese characteristics aka socialism with Chinese characteristics.
For US, its stock market is every thing. Greenspan put option is now permanent put option. The people be damned. The 1% must be protected.
If u are the 99% and no shares, how u going to join the 1%?
2021-05-15 11:21
U NEED TO INVEST REALLY VERY LONG TERM FOR CHINA LOH!
Posted by qqq3333 > May 15, 2021 11:21 AM | Report Abuse
Sslee > May 15, 2021 8:51 AM | Report Abuse
China is on an uptrend because of its people take responsibility and leaders lead.
US is on a downtrend because of its leader mislead and people blame each other but themselve.
So if you are an investor who do you want to invest in?
==============
not so simple.
First two sentence surely correct. ...but investing not so simple.
First u have to know that for China people and country come first and stock market not so much. Its capitalism with Chinese characteristics aka socialism with Chinese characteristics.
For US, its stock market is every thing. Greenspan put option is now permanent put option. The people be damned. The 1% must be protected.
If u are the 99% and no shares, how u going to join the 1%?
2021-05-15 11:27
For the 99% in US, life not getting easier. Only thing u can do improve your self is bet big. And hope for the best. Some do get lucky.
2021-05-15 11:31
the latest fad...cryto currency billionaires.
That is what America is about.
2021-05-15 11:33
d by stockraider > May 15, 2021 11:36 AM | Report Abuse
The chinese are world biggest gamblers, but luckily we have super good china CCP govt to control their citizens for their own good loh!
===========
well, that is true. If u got nothing to lose u gamble lah.
2021-05-15 11:48
The worse sin that will destroyed your wealth, family & happiness is uncontrolled gambling mah!
Very Much more damage & worse to control than lust for women & drugs loh!!
Posted by qqq3333 > May 15, 2021 11:48 AM | Report Abuse
d by stockraider > May 15, 2021 11:36 AM | Report Abuse
The chinese are world biggest gamblers, but luckily we have super good china CCP govt to control their citizens for their own good loh!
===========
well, that is true. If u got nothing to lose u gamble lah.
2021-05-15 11:52
China policy priorities now is preventing bubbles from forming..........more stringent enforcement of anti monopoloy laws, competition laws, cooling down property and stock market speculations,
America? America for the last 40 years has built an economy which encourage monopolies to grow while talking the opposite.
2021-05-15 11:54
Extreme right or extreme left are both bad. You need to take a middle path.
People need to take responsibility for their own action. And every action has a certain risk/reward. Oftentimes, managing risk down to zero is the biggest risk.
2021-05-15 12:09
The ancient China had advocated The Doctrine of the Mean ( Zhong Yong ) more than 2000 years ago .
Zhong ( middle ) is to be unbiased .Yong ( Regular ) is to be unchanging . Zhong , the unbiased way , is to be righteous course to be pursued by all under Heaven ,and Yong , the unchanging principle is the true law regulating all under Heaven. This is the heart of the body of work that has been handed down by the followers of Confucius .
Zi Si , fearing that this discipline may be distorted with the passage of time , wrote it down and passed it on to Mencius .
Both Gautama Buddha and Confucius advocated The middle Path and born 72 years apart in 623 BC and 551 BC respectively . The middle path is a universal wisdom .
2021-05-15 13:43
Deng Xiaoping was a moderate or Zhong Yong believer 中庸 派 . He was struggling between Capitalism vs Communism and looking for a in betwwen Hybrid of the two system which can work for China.He do not know whether such hybrid system ( socialism eith chinese characters)will work . Many remembered his famous.quote on Black cat and White cat but there was.another of his quote which is equally important . That is " Crossing the river by touching the rocks " or 摸着石头过河。 Since he did not know whether the hybrid system will work , he needs to experiment it first . He started with Shenzen and monitored its progress and adjusting the policy along the way.There was a big risk that the hybrid system may not work but Deng was.willing to take such risk against all odds. Deng decided to cross the river but he did not know how deep the river was. He need to touch the rocks and feel the depth while crossing it . Looking back It was a success by taking such risk. The entry into WTO.in year 2000 was another big risk China took against all critisms from its home industries which were not ready to compete at that time in 2000. China finally proved that they can compete by " crossing the river by touching the rocks".
Now , look at India . Does MODI or any future Indian leaders dare to take such risks? India decided to pull out of RCEP in the last minute giving the reason that it cant compete especially with China being a member. Indian leaders are too afraid of losing out and dare not take risks. They dared not cross the river by touching the rocks.They decided not to cross 。 They are scared of drowning.
2021-05-15 14:17
Mike,
How is your PA?
If only you listen to me and exchange your PA to LB Aluminium.
Never bought any Netx and now still collecting Insas and hopefully by this year to be in top 30 Insas shareholders list.
2021-05-19 09:37
Yes, sacrificing freedom can move things faster.
If your boss keeps on watching while you work, your productivity will go up but you are unhappy.
2021-05-19 09:40
https://klse.i3investor.com/blogs/Sslee_blog/2021-05-19-story-h1565126504-South_China_Seas_Baggage_and_Coca_Cola.jsp
Mike another article from Dr Tan Kee Wee if you are interest on current affair.
2021-05-19 09:44
Country that make things happen - China
Country that watch things happen - Malaysia
Country that want things not happen - US and othe Eyes.
Country that jealous things happen - India
Countries that applaud things happen - African countries
Country that does not know what has happened - Australia
2021-05-19 10:51
When Australia does not know what has happened in China, and start to challenge the mighty Chinese, Australians will have to beg for mercy as what it is now....
2021-05-19 10:54
During these 26 years .. China has launched more than 30 rocket to form the global GPRS networks .. and recent successful journey to Mars ..
China GPRS is most updated .. said to be at least equivalent to US GPRS if not better ...
Russia GRPS is outdated ..
England GPRS is of limited functions n is outdated ..
2021-05-19 15:01
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the first 30 years are foundational years....without the strong foundations of first 30 years, the miracle of last 40 also not possible
2021-05-14 08:16