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so you also want to become value investor (7) ?
stockmanmy
Publish date: Sun, 10 Jul 2016, 11:40 PM
stockmanmy
0 76
Trade at your own risk. I am here only to vomit out my feelings
Value investing is dead...died long time ago.
Two facts I just read tells me value investing is dead......died a long time ago.
- S & P 500 average PE ratio is 24
- This is the third quarter of declining profits in major corporations in S &P 500
For an value investor who believe in the nonsense they teach you in business schools and all the value investing formulas.....how do you reconcile the above two facts?
Value investing is a non factor in S & P or in DJ......It does not exist as a force. All talks of value investing is just a farce, deceiving you into believe in an alternative universe.
So, what is holding up share prices in an environment of declining profits?
Value investing my foot. It is not about value investing.
It is principally about FED policies, about interest rates, about excess liquidity, about mmomentum investing, about the alternatives for your money.
Don't believe in the lies about value investing.
Stock market is not about value investing.
Stock market is driven by liquidity and may the stock with the most momentum win.
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Be the first to like this. Showing 50 of 57 comments
who doesn't know about the macro-economics which affect money movement? and, your article is completely rubbish and pointless.
2016-07-11 08:02
"how do you reconcile the above two facts?" - I dont have to answer for what others paid.
2016-07-11 08:57
but who would want to own a business with falling profits and pay a higher and higher price?
the model they teach you is totally wrong.
cheoky > Jul 11, 2016 01:18 AM | Report Abuse
stock market is stock market, share is a ownership of the biz
2016-07-11 10:26
I got plenty more to say about value investing or " what is wrong with value investing"
Ricky Yeo > Jul 11, 2016 08:57 AM | Report Abuse
"how do you reconcile the above two facts?" - I dont have to answer for what others paid.
2016-07-11 10:28
Ricky Yeo - "how do you reconcile the above two facts?" - I dont have to answer for what others paid.
Nice Ricky, you sum everything up :D
2016-07-11 10:51
Democracy is the worse form of government except for all the rest
Stock market is the worse form of investment except for all the rest.
Well....stock market is indeed the worse form of investment many people have faced in their life.
2016-07-11 12:30
The biggest lie is to tell people buying a share you are buying a part of a business.
Value investing as a force in the stock market is negligible.
All the volume done, all the trades , are because people are looking for a place to park their money and or to speculate.
2016-07-11 12:35
ricky
nothing moves without a force.
now...who go flagging my posts?
show yourself.
the biggest lie of the stockmarket is you become part owner.
and actually nobody buys shares to be a part owner...or very very few.
2016-07-11 22:28
does anybody care about being part owner?
do fund managers care?
they just wanted a place to park their money.
2016-07-11 22:34
one chart to rule them all.
the above video is the one video that rules them all
the most complete, most accurate commentary I have ever come across.
2016-07-11 22:39
" 人是活的 书是死的。活人读死书 可以把书读活。死书读活人 可以把人读死。" what important is to maintain a flexibility in application of your knowledge in value investing or trading to suit the market conditions.
2016-07-11 23:00
value investing is dead.
Died a long time ago.
they only think they are doing value investing.
2016-07-11 23:12
what is ‘value‘? your shit is a waste to you but it could be valuable to others ie plants or business in operating water treatment plant. ‘ Value‘ is impermanance and very personal. a thing may be useless now but it could be valuable when conditions has changed.
2016-07-11 23:32
‘value‘ of a stock is very personal too. The shark valued Genetec at 30 cents when its top and bottom lines was growing. share price would certainly drop to low level when the value of "top and bottom lines growing " vanished...nobody wanted to offer higher value of the company.
2016-07-11 23:43
There are a lot of opportunity available in the share market if we undertand ‘value‘ of a company is impermanance....looking at the both sides of a matter...good bad, high low,.... value of a share is merely determined by fear and greed of human.
2016-07-11 23:53
not 1% of the trades is value investing yet 13 pays 100% to the 1% and ignores the other 99%.
OptimusPrime_ > Jul 11, 2016 11:21 PM | Report Abuse
Find value nowadays is like finding a virgin in maternity ward.
2016-07-11 23:57
Quote from: Oly Shyte on Yesterday at 11:38:44 AM
This argument lagi easy loh! What drive a stock price up? Operator inside loh! :D
Raider comment,
AGAIN OPERATOR IS SHORT TERM MAH...!!
How many of u all know any of the operator really well leh ?
Even u know them...do u think they will favour u in stock play ?
Raider can daring say ...most of u all...do not know any ?
Even if some of u know....they would not favour u loh....!!
This practical life mah.....!!
If that is the case...what the heck, u are interested of the market ?
IF U FOLLOW THE RUMOR, THE STOCKS RIGGED BY THE OPERATORS...MOST OF THE TIME.. LOSE MONIES loh...IT IS SOMETHING LIKE GAMBLING LOH...!!
AND IT IS A LOSER GAME mah.....!!
THATS WHY RAIDER SAY U NEED TO BE AN INTELLIGENT INVESTOR MAH....!!
BUY WITH MARGIN OF SAFETY....FORGET WHAT THE OPERATOR WILL DO LOH....!!
GO FOR FUNDAMENTAL, PROSPECT AND UNDERVALUATION, THE LONG TERM SURVIVAL KIT MAH...!!
RAIDER HAD SAY MANY TIME MARGIN OF SAFETY....HOPE U GET THE MESSAGE THRU...!!
DO NOT PLAY THE LOSER GAME....RIG BY THE OPERATOR LOH...!!
2016-07-12 00:44
you are right, if everyone practice value investing i would be the first to declare it is dead. The fact that value investing is a minority group as you mentioned, that's how it will continue to work. And need to thank you too for creating the volume. So keep doing at what you are doing.
2016-07-12 06:03
Some have earned a lot of money through practicing value investing whereas many were suffering losses. If you are a value investor, don't go beyond boundaries of having a thought making fast money. Value investing gives one the edge over others in longer term. If you want to make quick bucks then go for growth stocks but nothing comes with free lunch lor. You got to work hard and work smart to discover it early. If you want to make a quick profit and yet not willing to work hard and work smart, you can probably find a better chance of winning in Genting.
2016-07-12 09:43
value investing my foot.
S&P PE at 24, three Quarters of declining earnings.
value investing my foot.
2016-07-12 12:04
value is not what they company has
but value is what the company do with what it has
and for the rest of us....value is finding a place to park money at the correct risk - reward ratio.
2016-07-12 12:07
Go ahead to claim what you want to dumb down value investing. it doesn‘t affect me making money anyway. In fact, i am more happy to learn that.....our feeding ground is expabding the more you preach to newbies.
2016-07-12 12:21
value investing my foot.
if you want to make a difference.
go all-in at the appropriate time....and pray..and do some charity to increase your luck
if you have 10 different stocks and one of them up 10%...........................you have just made a grand total of 1%.....value investing, my foot. Wasting everybody's time.
2016-07-12 12:37
oh yes i love wasting time. I love to sit there and do nothing while i watch lemmings in and out
2016-07-12 12:42
Go to open new thread to spread the pitfall of value investing. Please back with your research with more facts this and that to convince newbies ..i support you. lol
2016-07-12 12:54
Ratios and formulas in value investing are still relevant... just that their validity period.. expiry date... shelf life... are getting shorter... that is why you seen the price coming down while the ratios formulas still ok
With the advance of the Internet.. and the easy availability of information nowadays... the validity period of value investings ratios.. formulas.. is now in quaterly... weekly.. even daily basis... as such appears not relevant..
2016-07-12 12:56
Ratios and formulas in value investing are still relevant..
relevant my foot.
there is this thing called selective memory.
people think it works because there is thing called selective memory.... . its selective memory.
in reality, cheap can get cheaper and expensive can get expensive just as often.
what appears value and beautiful is just appearance until it starts dropping and you get to see the ugliness in the former beauty.
2016-07-12 13:05
Chinwel... would be your real life bitter experience with the failure if the ratios and formulas??
2016-07-12 13:13
Ratios.. formulas... still relevant.. just that nowadays people are updating them with industry data.. financial models... seats statistics.. long before the release of the actual results
You wait till the actual results.. already way too late...
2016-07-12 13:16
in America
S&P PE at 24, five Quarters of declining earnings. ...but index at record high.
if there is such a thing as value investing, surely index cannot be at record after 5 quarters of declining earnings.
2016-07-12 15:05
This is wrong interpretation loh....!!
PE 24 means about 4% pa earnings yield mah...!!
The 30 years bond interest rate about 2.3% pa loh...!!
Bond 1 yr interest less than 0.5% pa....mah.....!!
Therefore PE 24x for USA looks not overvalue mah....!!
2016-07-12 15:17
value investing my foot.
in Spain, sovereign bond yields at 1%...that is 500 years low. Just a few years ago, they call it a PIGS country with double digit bond yields.
2016-07-12 15:19
That's why stock interest rate are relative mah....!!
Low interest rate ....European equity doing reasonably well despite brexit loh....!!
Btw...spain no longer double digit bond yield it is about 6% pa for a 10 yr bond loh....!!
2016-07-12 15:23
value investing my foot.
it is fund managers finding a place to park all the excess moneys printed by central banks.
2016-07-12 15:37
but some thing odd happened in Japan this year.......
Abe announced negative interest rates.... yen surged and equity drop sharply
currency market and stock market both decided to give two fingers to the central bankers.
I think we are on to something and years later , books will be written about the world's experiments by these central bankers.
value investing my foot.
2016-07-12 15:43
Again Japan....is short term movement....the voting machine story loh....!!
3 yrs down the road...people will be sorry....by defying economics chasing yen mah....!!
Raider still remember few yrs back yen is super strong at 85 yen to US 1 mah.......!!
2016-07-12 15:53
there is no value investing.
there is only funds looking for a place to park their money.
2016-07-12 15:59
ricky
what if you are very good value investor. Very good in your work.
and you can tell 5 Quarters ago that the companies you invested in will have 5 quarters of declining profits....will you tell yourself to be extra bullish on your portfolio?
The S&P just did that...It is at record highs after 5 Quarters of declining profits........
value investor my foot.
There is no value investing. Its a game....play the game or quit.
and......throw out all your value investing theories and find new ones.
2016-07-12 20:20
Margin of safety is all explain by B Graham mah....!!
Basing on assets value
Cashflow
Earnings
Hidden assets
Where the value of the company much more than the share price mah....!!
Stockmarket is an avenue....where u can look for bargain...where the value of business is much more than the share price overall value mah.....!!
The strategy is always buy low with deep margin of safety and sell at fair or overvalue to take advantage of Mr Market...!!
That's why basing on the above model raider always say Pet Dag.....overvalue mah....!!
NOTICE THE VALUE OF SHARE IS NOT ONLY DETERMINE BY EARNINGS MAH...!!
SO EARNINGS DROP DOES NOT MEAN THE COMPANY HAVE NO VALUE MAH....!!
2016-07-12 21:30
I like the way you guys think! Continue to do so because without you guys, i will never be able to reach my financial target! Jia you!!!
2016-07-12 22:48
The fact that NONE make it to the Forbes list with momentum investing remains. Prepare to get burn on both hands! The record high usually follow by a market crash ......
2016-07-12 22:50
of course ill be bullish, i know price has deviated from fundamentals, and im preparing my bullets
2016-07-13 10:17
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hmmm ... How about buying AAX at 25 sen after it's strong December 2015 quarterly result ? Isn't that value investing ?
2016-07-11 04:42