Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-03-17 18:37 | Report Abuse

Cold Eye冷眼’s 5 yardsticks for investment Cold Eye, during his talk on 16/3/2013, listed 5 important criteria for investing in a stock as below: 1. Return on equity, ROE, 2. Cash flow from operations and free cash flow, 3. PE ratio, 4. Dividend yield and 5. Net tangible asset backing per share, NTA If you invest RM100,000 in a business, you would want to have a reasonable return from the capital, or equity you put in. A business is risky and probably you may want a minimum return of say 25%. For investing in the share market, you may want a minimum return say 10%, 6% above the return you get from bank deposit? If the business only returns you 4%, why would you want to invest in it when you can get that rate from FD without having any worries at all? In your business, you would expect that all your debtors pay you promptly and that you don’t have to stock up a lot of inventories which will tied up your capital. Otherwise you would have to put in more capital each year even though you make money. I would expect the hard cash I can received must be about the earnings I make each year. My business would also require capital expenses each year to keep it going, better growing bigger so that I would earn more in the future. This I would need to buy more and replenish the equipment , buy or open more shops etc. It would be ideal if these expenses can be met with the cash I receive each year and not having to come up with more of my own money or borrow from bank. After that, I would be happy if there is still money left for me to draw out (as dividend), or the company can have extra money to invest in other lucrative business. This money available after all the capital expenses is termed as free cash flow, or FCF. If the above business make a lot of money, say 30000 a year, or 30%, would you buy it if the asking price is 1 million, or a PE of 33? This will give you a earnings yield of only 3%. Hence a good business does not mean it is a good investment if the price is too high. How nice it would be if the business earns enough for me to draw down 10,000 a year consistently. For my dividend yield would be 10%, 2.5 times that of FD rate. Besides my business is still growing. Well if at the end if I want to exit from the business, if the net tangible asset of my assets worth more than what I put in, or more, I can recoup my initial investment. These assets must of course the more valuable the better, for example hard cash, property and land etc, rather than some money which I have been arguing with the debtors whether they are going to pay me or not, or some inventories which are outdated. Hence NTA is important too although in some businesses, example the service industry where the important assets are its people, its technology or brand name rather than hard assets. Do you have any good stocks meeting the majority of the above criteria as given by Cold Eye to share? Or any lemon you may know which you want to tell others to be careful about? This discussions here is for sharing of knowledge and information and should not be construed as a forum for hard selling or condemning others of their stocks without giving justifications. Kcchongnz 17/3/2013

22 people like this.

260 comment(s). Last comment by bsngpg 2013-09-25 22:39

wooming

62 posts

Posted by wooming > 2013-06-15 09:20 | Report Abuse

please send to me too thank you.cmwoodust@gmail.com

moven00

729 posts

Posted by moven00 > 2013-06-15 09:50 | Report Abuse

KcChong, me too please...

Like to learn from you bro.

My email moven00@hotmail.com

Abudance

2,211 posts

Posted by Abudance > 2013-06-15 09:58 | Report Abuse

Me, too KC Chong. Would like very much to learn from you, too. My email is jkjoyful5@gmail.com. Thanks and God bless you!

nightrader

140 posts

Posted by nightrader > 2013-06-15 10:12 | Report Abuse

kcChong pls send me a copy too
you so good with analysis work
my email chongsdk@gmail.com
thanks

Posted by sweetfun > 2013-06-15 10:33 | Report Abuse

kcchongnz pls send me your FA template too, my email swee_fun@yahoo.com i'm green but willing to learn, thanks a bunch

trader96

134 posts

Posted by trader96 > 2013-06-15 10:45 | Report Abuse

kcchongnz i would like to learn from you , could you please send me your template to my email lch_69@hotmail.com
thank you so much

thwalim

11 posts

Posted by thwalim > 2013-06-15 11:55 | Report Abuse

kccgongnz, i would like to have a template too, thank you very much.

thwalim

11 posts

Posted by thwalim > 2013-06-15 11:55 | Report Abuse

ha ha, forgot to give email address; thwalim2000@yahoo.com

gmchiam

1 posts

Posted by gmchiam > 2013-06-15 16:45 | Report Abuse

kcchongnz, please send me a copy of your template to chiamguikmeng@gmail.com

kcchongnz

6,684 posts

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-06-15 16:59 | Report Abuse

Posted by plutus > Jun 14, 2013 11:22 PM | Report Abuse
Hi @kcchongnz, if you don't mind, could you send a copy of your FA worksheet to achilles_hee@hotmail.com? Many thanks.

I have hard time calculating ROIC actually, according to morningstar definition you based upon, ROIC=NOPAT/IC
The issue is how to judge IC (invested previous year) like you do..
Can I interpret it as
Total asset -
(free cash flow at the end of last year?) -
(non-interest bearing current liabilities ex:payable, provision, deferred tax) - (other liabilities ex: pension fund etc.?)

Plutus, invested capital means capital invested in the ordinary business. This equals to Total assets-non interest bearing current liabilities-excess cash-investments not consolidated in the account.

Excess cash is cash not needed for the ordinary business. this is equal to cash and cash equivalent less Max[0, (current liabilities-current assets)], not including cash and cash equivalent.

Investment in associates, jv, properties etc not consolidated in the account is less off from invested capital

Or the other way is IC=fixed asset (PPE+prepaid lease payment+biological assets)+net working capital (account receivables+inventories-account payable)

You will be able to see how I obtain the invested capital in the spreadsheet I have sent to you.

Cheers.

evelygtc

11 posts

Posted by evelygtc > 2013-06-15 20:35 | Report Abuse

I have some cash in hand.
Shall I buy Public Bank or Maybank?
When is the right time to buy?
Please advise.
I am a new investor.
Thank you.

tsurukame

778 posts

Posted by tsurukame > 2013-06-15 21:01 | Report Abuse

Hi Kcchongnz, Please send a copy of your FA template to amadas7@gmail.com. Thank you and best wishes.

hynix

26 posts

Posted by hynix > 2013-06-15 21:11 | Report Abuse

Hi Kcchongnz,i wish to learn from you. Please send a copy of your FA template to iamttk89@gmail.com. Thank you and best wishes.

yfchong

5,888 posts

Posted by yfchong > 2013-06-15 21:42 | Report Abuse

If dun my can u send me a copy of template email yfchg71@yahoo.com thks

choolooi

310 posts

Posted by choolooi > 2013-06-15 22:19 | Report Abuse

Kcchong, you are one hell of a generous guy, sharing your expertise and research with all in this website.

Very glad to have read your postings.
Heartfelt thanks.
Is there another pintaras ? I just joined this site a month ago and thus missed boarding the Pintaras Express .

aunloke

974 posts

Posted by aunloke > 2013-06-15 22:41 | Report Abuse

I said it before and I say again :- he is like a beacon on the bay !

joe2703

123 posts

Posted by joe2703 > 2013-06-15 22:46 | Report Abuse

kcchong, can you send it to me also ? I have a lot to learn from you. Thanks you so much!

My email, hongyeh2u@hotmail.com

sbeck99

2 posts

Posted by sbeck99 > 2013-06-15 22:50 | Report Abuse

kcchong, can i have a copy too..

my email, sbeck99@ymail.com

tee0823

4 posts

Posted by tee0823 > 2013-06-15 23:00 | Report Abuse

Dear KCChong, Please send a copy to my email tee_laycheng@yahoo.com.

Thank you very much

William

413 posts

Posted by William > 2013-06-15 23:02 | Report Abuse

I also need it. Thanks for sharing. Could you send it to my email : William_cwchan05@hotmail.com

Cylp

9 posts

Posted by Cylp > 2013-06-15 23:27 | Report Abuse

kcchong, I m new and I m impressed of the way u share your expertise, could u pls send a copy to my email too: connieyeonglp@gmail.com. Thks!

kcchongnz

6,684 posts

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-06-16 06:19 | Report Abuse

Posted by Tan KW > Jun 15, 2013 08:27 PM | Report Abuse
received. thank you very much!
what is Piotroski?

Appended below is a link explaining what Pitroski Score is.

http://www.grahaminvestor.com/articles/quantitative-tools/the-piotroski-score/

It is similar to the Altman Z-score, used to check the likelihood that a company can go bankrupt. If one buys the stocks of good companies, this is not a concern. But if one hunts for low price stocks which have been in persistent downtrend for a long time,speculating in the market, following the daily hot stocks and listening to market rumours, he should check the stock with this Pitroski Score first before risking his money. Use it to check stocks like KNM, Patimas, Smartag, Amedia, Tiger, Lion, Leopard etc, even for Ivory, Perisai, London Biscuits etc.

The thing is if there is a high likelihood that that company may face trouble, why invest in it when there are thousands of other opportunities?

choolooi

310 posts

Posted by choolooi > 2013-06-16 06:33 | Report Abuse

Kcchongnz,
I forgot to ask for a copy in my last posting.
Can u please give me a copy.?
In appreciation ,

choolooi

310 posts

Posted by choolooi > 2013-06-16 06:36 | Report Abuse

Kcchongnz
Oops forgot to give you my email ---choolooi@gmail.com

Donpazac

54 posts

Posted by Donpazac > 2013-06-16 07:05 | Report Abuse

@ Kcchongnz,
Always enjoy reading your analysis. Please send me a copy too.

My email: donpazac@gmail.com
Appreciate your sharing. Thank you!

2862862

300 posts

Posted by 2862862 > 2013-06-16 07:16 | Report Abuse

me too m.o.r.e@outlook.com

many thanks

Donpazac

54 posts

Posted by Donpazac > 2013-06-16 07:30 | Report Abuse

@ Kcchongnz,
Received with a million thanks!

kcchongnz

6,684 posts

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-06-16 08:11 | Report Abuse

Almost miss these cynical comments until I notice the writer.

Posted by Lucky88 > Jun 14, 2013 04:55 PM | Report Abuse
Hm.. I think CSL could beat all your PE, ROE, NTA, ...

Posted by iafx > Jun 14, 2013 10:14 PM | Report Abuse
@lucky, good point u got there. :)

What is wrong with these comments. Nothing. On the contrary they are useful. I make cynical comments too once a while but with some good intentions.

Yes, one has to be cynical when hearing and reading rumours, market experts, real or pretend, telling them to buy this share and that share. Try evaluate yourself; what they say so, what is their reasoning, motive etc. Ultimately it is yourself to take full responsibility of your own actions.

Posted by Student2213 > 2013-06-16 08:13 | Report Abuse

Hi mr kcchongnz, morning. I am new. Do you mind to send me a copy to learn more? My email student2213@gmail.com truly appreciate ur hard work. Tq

Posted by paulwongtp > 2013-06-16 15:05 | Report Abuse

me too please paulwongtp73@yahoo.com thank you

Posted by Sunshine88 > 2013-06-16 15:42 | Report Abuse

Dear Mr. kcchong, iam a beginner. I am interested in your template. Could you please send me a copy as well. My email is teh_huiming@yahoo.com. Appreciate for your help. Thank you very much...

w2sin

64 posts

Posted by w2sin > 2013-06-16 16:09 | Report Abuse

me too thank you
my email: w2sin@yahoo.com

Posted by 19Dec19704933 > 2013-06-16 16:15 | Report Abuse

kcchong, can you send it to me also ? I have a lot to learn from you. Thanks you so much!

My email is fyam@tm.net.my

chkoe2

8 posts

Posted by chkoe2 > 2013-06-16 19:14 | Report Abuse

Kcchong, pls send me a template too., learning so much fr u. My email chkoe2@pd.jaring.my ....thkq.

mas1998

3 posts

Posted by mas1998 > 2013-06-16 19:30 | Report Abuse

kcchong , can you send me a template too.
my email : kentleec@yahoo.com
thanks.

Posted by optimuslyk > 2013-06-16 20:03 | Report Abuse

Hi kcchong,
May I have a copy, please?
Thank-you very much.
Optimuslyk@ gmail.com

wtclau

59 posts

Posted by wtclau > 2013-06-16 20:39 | Report Abuse

Hi Kcchongnz,i wish to learn from you. Please send a copy of your FA template to wtclau@yahoo.com.sg. Thanks.

Darren Kho

733 posts

Posted by Darren Kho > 2013-06-16 20:52 | Report Abuse

Bro kcchongnz,
I'm a newbie and would like to learn more about investment. Please send me a copy too and thanks a lot. My e-mail is darrenkho88@yahoo.co.nz

Posted by Vincent Wong > 2013-06-16 21:07 | Report Abuse

Me too.
vincentwongchungkai@gmail.com

fishbone

120 posts

Posted by fishbone > 2013-06-16 21:08 | Report Abuse

Dear kcchongnz,

Could you please send me a copy. Thanks.

ngyewsang@yahoo.com

fankim

139 posts

Posted by fankim > 2013-06-16 21:11 | Report Abuse

Hi kcchongnz, if you don't mind please send a copy to my email fankim@gmail.com.

thanks in advance.

reyes430

204 posts

Posted by reyes430 > 2013-06-16 21:15 | Report Abuse

Hi KC, please send me a copy too
Gnihckes430@hotmail.com

lkloke

111 posts

Posted by lkloke > 2013-06-16 21:20 | Report Abuse

Hi kcchongnz, appreciate if you could send a copy to my email address at lklloke@yahoo.com

Thanks in advance. Hope to meet you one of these days and buy you a cup of teh tarik.

Cheers,

Loke

hsong

194 posts

Posted by hsong > 2013-06-16 22:12 | Report Abuse

pls send me a copy as well hsong2000@hotmail.com

many thanks

garlic

30 posts

Posted by garlic > 2013-06-16 22:20 | Report Abuse

arigato arigato ex-contractor, kindly drop me a copy also at i3garlic@gmail.com

yus7888

97 posts

Posted by yus7888 > 2013-06-16 22:25 | Report Abuse

kcchong,same strategy with Cold eyes, please include my email yus7888@gmail.com

zaprija

14 posts

Posted by zaprija > 2013-06-16 23:37 | Report Abuse

Dear Mr kcchong,
Appreciate if you could send a copy to zaprija@gmail.com, always read your posting and would like to learn more from your expetise.
Cheers

Posted by idchong3 > 2013-06-16 23:51 | Report Abuse

Hi Mr KC,

If you dont mind kindly send me a copy to my email idchong3@yahoo.com too. I am very interested to learn more. Thank you.

Idchong

tanbk1949

12 posts

Posted by tanbk1949 > 2013-06-17 00:17 | Report Abuse

Hi KC hongnz,

Appreciate your help if you could forward a copy of template to tbkmichal49@yahoo.com

WongKK

2 posts

Posted by WongKK > 2013-06-17 10:33 | Report Abuse

Hi KCChongnz,

Would appreciate it very much if you could give me a copy of your FA Template. My email is kkwong699@hotmail.com

TQ.

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