Posted by Kent Lee > 2012-05-30 17:14 | Report Abuse

oh OSK..... sorry to say this.... i don't trust OSK at all

Posted by chongkonghui > 2012-05-30 17:43 | Report Abuse

too little cash from the deal, can't expect capital repayment.

Posted by diablo88 > 2012-05-31 09:49 | Report Abuse

another piece of good news is coming out. hang on there. no need panic

Posted by cflee > 2012-05-31 10:02 | Report Abuse

what kind of news?

Posted by diablo88 > 2012-05-31 10:11 | Report Abuse

that one I cannot tell you yet.
but I can say for sure that they are not going pn17 because the fact is that they are not selling their business, they are just merging and reinvesting the money in RHB. If they are purely selling it and getting the cash then for sure they will get into pn17.

Posted by jpleow > 2012-05-31 12:33 | Report Abuse

OSK won't be PN17.

In the attachment in 28/5/12 bursa announcement, they said:
"The Board intends to maintain the listing status of OSKH after the Proposed Disposal and will apply to Bursa Securities for a waiver from classifying OSKH as an affected listed issuer under PN17 of the Listing Requirements as OSKH will continue to have other sustainable businesses in addition to its equity stake in RHBC."

In Business Times news on 29/5/12, they said:
"OSK Holdings Bhd plans to maintain its listed status and look for other businesses to embark on once it sells off its investment bank, its founder says.
Still, founder and major shareholder Ong Leong Huat, 67, points out that the group will still have some other businesses remaining like property, property-management and money-lending.
"Along the way, my board and I - which also comprise a lot of good business people - will look at what other businesses we can embark on."
http://www.btimes.com.my/articles/rhbee2/Article/

However, the deal is still unfair for minority shareholders since there is no capital repayment! I think we should vote against the resolution in the upcoming EGM!

Bursa has changed the rule to better protect the rights of minority shareholders, now they need more than 70% votes to pass resolution involving sale of company assets. If minority shareholders with more than 30% shares can unite & vote against it, then the whole merger deal will be off! This will teach OLH a lesson & let him know that "BETTER DEAL FOR MINORITY SHAREHOLDERS OR NO DEAL!"

Posted by danielttoob > 2012-06-01 16:49 | Report Abuse

vrooom

Posted by mrK0K3N > 2012-06-01 16:50 | Report Abuse

It's rather "brooom" than "vrooom"...hehe...

Posted by Namoyaki Takarajima > 2012-06-01 16:52 | Report Abuse

mrKOK, LOL, jangan "puuuuuuuutttttttt" sudah lah... hahaha

Posted by chongkonghui > 2012-06-01 17:21 | Report Abuse

RM1.50 ~ is it a safe level to enter?

Posted by chongkonghui > 2012-06-01 17:31 | Report Abuse

To jpleow:

To "unite" 30% shareholders is almost impossible. The rule should be 10% instead of 30%.

Posted by danielttoob > 2012-06-01 18:00 | Report Abuse

good buy

Posted by jpleow > 2012-06-03 12:19 | Report Abuse

I did some research on Bursa Malaysia & Securities Commission web sites & found out that the actual vote required to pass the resolution involving MAJOR DISPOSAL OF ASSETS are 75% not 70% as I posted earlier.

http://www.bursamalaysia.com/website/bm/regulation/rules/listing_requirements/downloads/bm_mainchapter10.pdf
"
PART F(A) – MAJOR DISPOSAL OF ASSETS RESULTING IN LISTED CORPORATIONS NO LONGER SUITABLE FOR LISTING
10.11A Major Disposal
(1) A listed corporation which intends to undertake a Major Disposal must:
...
(d) convene a general meeting and obtain shareholder approval of at least 75% in value of the shareholders present and voting either in person or by proxy at the meeting for such Major Disposal.
"

Hence we only need 25% of minority shareholders to vote against it to disapprove the resolution in EGM.

From the OSK 2011 Annual report
(For those who did not received the Annual Report CD, it can be downloaded from http://announcements.bursamalaysia.com/EDMS/subweb.nsf/all/04D19C20EF014780482579C6002E9EDC/$File/OSK-AnnualReport2011%20(1.4MB).pdf),
on page 242, I found out that there were 29,054 shareholders where the 30 largest shareholders have total of 51.4% shares. So even if all these 30 largest shareholders are acting in concert with OLH (which I doubt so), there are around 48% small shareholders left to vote against the resolution. OLH has a total of 32.19% direct & indirect shares. (consistent with report in Business Times news on 29/5/12, http://www.btimes.com.my/articles/rhbee2/Article/
)

I think what OLH wants is to control the 10% RHB shares received through OSK. With this 10% shares he will be the 3rd largest shareholder of RHB and he will have influence in RHB board. If there is a capital repayment to distribute the RHB shares received, he will only has control of 3.2% of RHB shares.

With 10% hareholding, RHB is not even an associate company of OSK (>20% is associate company, >50% is subsidiary company) & OSK cannot consolidate the earnings of RHB into its earnings! It can only be classified under Investment in the balance sheet, only dividends from RHB can be classified as earnings! Hence after merger, OSK will be heavy in assets but very light in earnings. I doubt the remaining business and new business will be enough to compensate for the earnings loss from the old business disposed! The EPS will be very low & hence PER very high and the value of the heavy assets can only be unlocked if there is a capital repayment.

I took a look at the form of proxy in 2011 AGM, I found that we can appoint proxy to vote on behalf of us. You can appoint the Chairman of the Meeting as your proxy and indicate with an "X" in the appropriate space how you wish your proxy to vote. So for those small shareholders who are either unable or inconvenient to attend the EGM, all they need to do is to spend a little bit of time to fill up the proxy form and pay a little bit of postage to send out the form.

Please spread the words around & push the message through to all small shareholders, this may pressure OLH to change the unfair deal, the best outcome would be a full capital repayment (very slim chance), the 2nd best outcome would be cancellation of the merger. I think OSK has viable & promising business even without the merger.

WE MAY BE SMALL FISH BUT UNITED WE CAN BEAT THE BIG BAD SHARK!

Posted by danielttoob > 2012-06-05 11:23 | Report Abuse

good counter to enter?

Posted by Fat Cat Tim Buddy > 2012-06-05 11:24 | Report Abuse

osk is never a good counter

Posted by Kent Lee > 2012-06-05 20:14 | Report Abuse

osk screwed us all......

Posted by JT1969 > 2012-06-06 16:40 | Report Abuse

Not unusual ..

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-06 22:53 | Report Abuse

From the "nexttrade" blog by Alex Lu, a remisier with Kenanga, has this opinion:

[Quote] "RHBCap is a cheap banking stock. On that basis, it is a good buy. OSK will turn into a property stock, with a sizable stake in RHBCap. As a property stock, it would attract a lower PE multiple, which may cause the share price to drop a bit. However, I believe OSK will distribute the RHBCap stake (245 million shares) to its shareholders. Based on current outstanding shares of 965 million, it would work out to be 1 RHBCap share for every 4 OSK shares owned. If you work on that basis, OSK would be a cheap entry into RHBCap." [End Quote]

OSK is now at 1.40. I believe the dust from last week's disappointment, plus the heavy selling on Monday due to worries over Europe, could be over. If Alex Lu is correct, then OSK investors could be sitting on a tidy profit in the near future -- 1 RHB Cap for 4 OSK or 25%, with the former at 7.30 now would be a great deal.

Posted by danielttoob > 2012-06-07 09:46 | Report Abuse

so OSK worth price?

Posted by DKNYCOM > 2012-06-07 10:09 | Report Abuse

TARGET BUYING PRICE AT RM 1.35 - RM 1.38 LEVEL.
GOOD COUNTER

Posted by chongkonghui > 2012-06-07 10:43 | Report Abuse

it seem like the price has been manipulated down when the value are high up there.

i'm getting advance from margin facility to buy 10,000 shares @ 1.40

Posted by chongkonghui > 2012-06-08 17:13 | Report Abuse

Patience is seriously required now for OSK...

Posted by Kent Lee > 2012-06-08 17:55 | Report Abuse

OSK will be penny stock soon......

Posted by dknycom > 2012-06-08 19:35 | Report Abuse

DON'T KNOW IS LUCKY OR NOT? I JUST BOUGHT 20 LOTS FOR RM 1.35 TODAY. OSK STILL CAN REBOUND? OR GOING TO BECOME " PENNY STOCK " VERY SOON AS KENT LEE SAID?

Posted by andyteng > 2012-06-08 19:48 | Report Abuse

it is for long term

Posted by Kent Lee > 2012-06-08 20:46 | Report Abuse

good luck DKNY.... i hope I am wrong......

Posted by dknycom > 2012-06-08 21:24 | Report Abuse

I only targeting to rebound until RM 1.50 level in short term.
Hopefully can reach this level very soon.

Posted by ingwong > 2012-06-09 15:04 | Report Abuse

looks like it will go down a point or two if the market go downtrend on monday, but I doubt it...US data looked good on friday 8/6 though...Just to be safe..I queue 20 lots on 1.3, 1.31, 1.33 and 10 lots on 1.34 respectively...see how it goes..cross my fingers..election should be sometimes in September during 2013 Budget weeks...after Hari Raya. Therefore, a month or so dancing with bear? hope not..any comment..guys

Posted by dknycom > 2012-06-09 15:23 | Report Abuse

i think the support line for OSK will be around RM 1.30.
More of worst will be around RM 1.20

RM 1.35 level is quite safe for enter now.

Posted by ingwong > 2012-06-09 18:32 | Report Abuse

Thanks dk for the input, hopefully can acuire some on monday..just want to procure a bit..thanks again...cheers

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-09 20:38 | Report Abuse

As @jpleow mentioned above, the major shareholders need 75% of the votes to approve the sale to RHB Capital. But they control only 52%. This means the minority shareholders like us will have a big say in this.

We don't mind the sale - however, what's in it for us? Why should we content with having a 10% stake in RHB Capital if it's only for the main shareholder to use as basis for his own power in it? At the very least, OSK will have to give some sort of a special dividend. Better yet, distribute the RHB Capital shares. We are small but in this case we have power if we act together to put pressure. This deal would be scuttled if OSK can't get the 75% at the EGM.

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-09 20:46 | Report Abuse

#dknycom - You've gotten it at a very reasonable price and the downside should be low. I bought at a higher price - 1.40. The price was affected by the general downturn in the market. So, if the market goes up next week, OSK should recover too.

I'm betting on these: (1) there is value in this counter at current prices (2) OSK will have to throw in some sweeteners if they want to get the 75% approval.

Posted by ingwong > 2012-06-09 21:04 | Report Abuse

Mat has very good point indeed..enlighten my vhorizon a whole lot..hope can buy some as well...regards

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-09 22:13 | Report Abuse

ingwong: Remember, these are just *opinions* and I have been wrong so many times before. Even when a counter's price looks `low enough', we have seen how it can go even lower. There are various variables that will come into play and decide whether it goes up or down. The future - this is something that we simply can't guarantee about.

That said, since we are in this investing/trading business, we simply must take risks to try and benefit. The other alternatives are fixed deposits - safe but with crummy interest. Or trust funds - not really safe and often get beaten by direct trading in the stock market.

Having said that, when it comes to OSK, I believe we can take a calculated risk with it. Especially at this price. That's because of the RHB Capital deal - further news about it is bound to move the price. Upwards seems to be the more probable.

Posted by ingwong > 2012-06-09 23:06 | Report Abuse

Thanks Mat, I truly appreciate you kind and generous opinions. I am new to the market..for less than a year..about 9 months on and off...lost around 150k so far. 500k capital left 350k..A 150k lesson..Just to name a few-Lost on Nicorp..Times..YTL power and its warrant. The main reason being buying too big a hand using contra..100 to 500 lots depending on the counters, the losses accumulated really quick. I slow down a bit now and start to read more and try to learn even more from other experience investors like you. Advices really help, at least I am not simply throwing here and there. Made a little on the SKPETRO but retreat too early. Honestly speaking I don't really read the news carefully before but now I do...Better be safe than sorry is my strategy nowadays..I am quite upset about the losses but still ok mentally. Just have to accept the facts that I am not a good trader. I keep telling myself, "I need to go slow and steady". I'll make it back one days with patient and right counters. I switch to cash account fully recently to avoid using contra. Once again..I appreciate your advices..best regards

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-09 23:31 | Report Abuse

Sorry to hear about the losses. When we enter the stock market, this is always a risk. And especially with contra trades. I'm sure each and every one of us here have suffered losses at one time or another.

I've followed the market for some years although I've been inactive; coming back only a few months ago after I've rebuilt my capital. I'm one of those unlucky sods who was playing the market in the early 1990's, made some losses, was discouraged... and totally missed the 1994/4 Great Bull run! It tormented me to see shares that I had sold shooting so high: KLK - had sold it at 3.60 (went to 24.00); Time, sold at 1.90 (went to 9.00) etc. But at the same time, I didn't come back in when the market was at its peak - would have been wiped out. I did enter in the late 1990's but made losses.

But I've learned a few things which I hope will result in better investing this time. For one thing, there are groups like this where you can seek others' opinions - there were none some years ago. This is a very important tool. At the same time, one must try not to be too influenced by the opinions here - use your own judgement at all times. After all, it's your money on the line.

I've also learned that it's all about timing - the price doesn't really matter. Often, neither does the company! If a company is going up, it doesn't matter what the current price is. Conversely, if the price is in decline, it doesn't matter how good or profitable the company is. Here lies the problem: we don't *really* know if the price is going up. Or down. Yes, technical charts can help somewhat but this is just to an extent.

Nowadays, I try to do these: (1) Ensure the company is solid plus with dividends. This way, if I have to settle and wait, at least I can comfort myself with the dividends.

(2) Use technical charts to see when the best (or better) time is to buy it - see whether there is a breakout. Try ChartNexus.com's free program first. But one will have to learn how to read the charts. Over time, you will get better. Yes, all trades start as contra with me - if I can profit within the period, well and fine. If I can't, and if I still feel it's a good price, I will settle and wait.

I've also learned that patience is indeed a virtue. As long as we don't buy near a company's historical high price, and if it's a solid company, we tend to make a profit if we wait long enough. Finally, never put everything in one basket no matter how seemingly good it looks. It's better to be cautious and diversify - different counters PLUS at different times. With SKPETRO for instance: everyone knows it's a good company. So, when it was in the 1.90-something, we should have bought "some" - not all of the allocated capital but maybe one-third or so. This way, if it were to go down to 1.80-something, we can buy another one-third. If it goes up before that, then it's great for we will at least get something.

This is what I'm trying to do with OSK. It's fortunate I didn't put all my allocated capital at 1.40 despite feeling it's "already low".

Posted by CP TEH > 2012-06-10 00:32 | Report Abuse

Dear Mat Cendana

Can I ask permission to copy what you have written here into my blog for my own keeping and sharing with others?

What you have written here is a very good sharing with MANY newbies and novices as that is what we should be doing ... sharing and learning from each other.

Hope to get a nod from you.

Regards

TEH

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-10 00:45 | Report Abuse

CP TEH: Of course. And you don't have to pay any royalties either:-P This is a public forum after all. That's what we should do - share opinions and help each other out and try to profit from the stock market. Just remember that these are just my own opinions of which could be wrong.

Posted by CP TEH > 2012-06-10 01:03 | Report Abuse

Mat Cendana : Thanks, sir. I will write further comment in my blog.

TEH

Posted by ingwong > 2012-06-10 01:19 | Report Abuse

Hi Mat, thank you very much for spending so much times sharing all the valuable experiences. The main reason for me to enter the market is hoping to gain enough to buy a nice house. I booked a house last year prior to construction. It is still under various procedures but likely to make progress towards end of the year. Obviously the motive was fine but the strategies were definitely all wrong. I was too eager or even too greedy hoping to win some quick cash from the market. Bad ideas, the stock market is for the patience investors like what you have mentioned about. I will definitely taking your advices and store in my subliminal mind reviewing it from times to times, In fact, your advices is the very first that I have received with thoughts and understandings in correspondence writings. I truly appreciate it. Being educated under a Chinese school educational system throughout childhood and high school, I have better understandings of Chinese language; therefore, I read mostly Chinese books and periodicals. My old folks are farmers; they worked very hard providing foods and shelters for my eight siblings including myself. You know, there weren’t many books to read some 20-30 years ago, simply couldn’t effort it; we rather use the money to buy foods instead. I still recall the contentment of reading Hong Kong comics books borrowed from a wealthy classmate in the old days. Boys, those were the good time. I know nothing about share trading back in 1990’s, not even 2000’s. I started buying two Public bank funds in 2008 due to the advices of two friends working at the public bank and found out later those were the worst mutual funds of all time in term of performance. My 58,000 left with 30,000 in 2012. If I add up the opportunity cost and interests for a period of time over four years, the losses has mounted to 50% or so. I don’t believe in any mutual funds staff or manager since then. They only ask you to buy and never advice you to sell simply because it is the bank’s policy. That was the second reason why I trade myself rather than letting the fund managers doing the trade. Now that I have learned that ‘trading’ with profit is indeed a colossal task to compose. I will be humbly paying more respects towards advisor like you as well as the market. It is because you are a good advisor and the share market is indeed a place that takes patience and endurance to build one’s wealth with characters. Warmest regards

Posted by CP TEH > 2012-06-10 01:29 | Report Abuse

Hi Ingwong,

Sorry to hear about your losses. Yes, we get wiser. That is good and we do have some good investors who will share and help.

Can I ask permission to share your writings or sharing here in my blog too?

Stay well.

TEH

Posted by ingwong > 2012-06-10 01:39 | Report Abuse

Hi Teh,
sure indeed..by all means. Actually, this is the only forum that I write.. Again, thanks to Mat Candena for his kind and valuble advices . warmest regards

Posted by CP TEH > 2012-06-10 01:49 | Report Abuse

Hi

Thanks. Just stay focus to learn and listen to few good ones here. Ignore many other noises as forums could be a very noisy place, at times.

This is one if he best public forum around. So, I am glad that you came to a good site here.

Happy Sunday.

TEH

Posted by ingwong > 2012-06-10 01:56 | Report Abuse

Thanks Teh,
Will take you advice as well..will log off soon. got company function tomorrow..talk later..happy Sunday to you too,,

Posted by Fat Cat Tim Buddy > 2012-06-10 07:00 | Report Abuse

osk, the most powerful screw-everyone in the world, and would burn your hand clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?

....

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-10 11:01 | Report Abuse

ingwong: Thank you for sharing your experiences. For someone who was from a farmer's family, you have sure come a long way; being able to have that sum of capital and on the verge of buying a nice house. I'm really impressed with your attitude. Your honesty, willingness to acknowledge your mistakes plus the desire to learn will see you improve and do much better in the future, all else being equal.

Hoping to make quick and easy money - I would say this is everyone's hope actually. After all, why not if one can do so? And I have certainly done so myself when the opportunity presents itself. Just two weeks ago, I bought MAS at 1.06 - I know it had made big losses but it was a calculated risk since it's a GLC and the government will surely bail it out again and again if needed to. Besides, it also made smaller losses and I felt the price was low enough. Had intended to wait for a month or so and sell when I had 10% profit. I was surprised to see it going up the next day!... immediately sold it at 1.18 since that's my target.

Sometimes, one does get very lucky; sometimes a bit lucky, or sometimes not very. That's how it goes. In your case, you *might* have gotten the fast and easy money when you entered. As I had said, it's just a question of timing - if luck would have it, you might have bought when the price was at the very bottom, and immediately spring up after that. This is what everyone hopes for, and sometimes it does happen. But on many occasions, it doesn't. Therefore, we will have to do some research and thinking first; otherwise it is tantamount to gambling.

In your case, you still have a sizeable capital left. Don't beat yourself too hard trying to recover it back as fast as possible - this might set you up towards being too hasty and taking huge risks. If these risks work, then fine. But what if they don't? Consider doing what some companies do when restructuring due to losses - capital reduction where a RM1.00 par value share now becomes 75 sen par. In your case, look at your capital and see what it is now - 350K, and start on a fresh note without being pressured by the previous losing trades. Doing so will put less pressure on you. With your attitude and newly-learned lessons, I have the feeling you will do well and achieve what you had intended to do, honestly.

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-10 11:19 | Report Abuse

Besides keeping tabs on the forum here, you might want to do some research yourself. One easy way is through The Edge's weekly (RM5). The latest issue is already out and you can buy it anywhere (11-16 June issue). Look for this page: "FACTSET estimates consensus". In the previous issue (I haven't gone out to buy the new one yet) it's on page 48 (capital), comprising The Edge/JCF Estimates Consensus table.

This table covers only some of the companies listed in BSKL. But no matter - there are useful information that you can research and act on. See under the section of "RECOMMENDATION CONSENSUS 75 DAYS AS OF 29/05/12" (or a newer date) - the numbers are ratings where smaller is better. Do some research on the companies with 1.00 or slightly higher. These are the companies which these foreign analysts keep tabs on. The ones you should consider should also have good daily turnover - doesn't have to be heavy but at the same time `not sleeping'.

Can't guarantee the companies with the smaller numbers will go up. For all you know, it's those with 3.00 (rated as "Sell") that might! This would be due to speculators piling in. However, at the very least, you will know that the companies you chose are also highly rated by the analysts. But don't limit yourself to just these, of course. There are many other companies not mentioned in the table that have the potential to make us money.

Things are rather volatile nowadays. But that's also a good thing because it creates opportunities. Have a few counters in your list and follow them - when the price goes down, see that as a chance to enter. Track them through the technical charts and see whether they are on the upswing again. If a company is good and if we wait a reasonable time (not the contra period) plus set a profit target, our chances of success will be much better. Good luck!

Posted by Namoyaki Takarajima > 2012-06-10 11:19 | Report Abuse

Thank you brothers. Thank you ingwong, thank you Teh, Thank you Mat and everyone. So lets works hand in hand combining all our experties regardless whatever background we are and stay positive; so we can do much better in Share Markets. Sharing is Caring and Caring is Loving. Thanks again. 'Brothers in Arms'-Dire Straits.

Posted by Namoyaki Takarajima > 2012-06-10 11:35 | Report Abuse

http://m.youtube.com/index?desktop_uri=%2F&gl=MY#/watch?v=5vUDmFjWgVo
P.S: Today is Sunday and Sunday is a beautiful day. Special song to everyone especially to brother ingwong. We are brothers.

Posted by Mat Cendana > 2012-06-10 12:10 | Report Abuse

Namoyaki: Brothers in Arms is one of my all-time favourite songs, along with Telegraph Road:-)