Posted by probability > 2020-02-06 22:33 | Report Abuse

what is 50M shared between 2 person indirectly versus the Billions ringgit interest they have on AA.........

That 50M did not even went to their pocket...may be RM 1k went in

you think all other companies in Bursa are held by "Puritans"?? They dont buy anything for their customers??

fcuk the hypocrisy....

market really need to wake up leh!
.................................

Posted by Cupcakes69 > 2020-02-06 22:55 | Report Abuse

@Probability

Financial implications aside. If Tony and KM really did accept bribes for their personal gains, it's the integrity of management to fulfill their fiduciary roles to AA is what's in question. Does it really make any sense to put money into a company even if you know management don't even have the decency to not use the company to accept bribes. Bribes for god sake!!

Posted by Investor48 > 2020-02-06 23:05 | Report Abuse

Local transmission is getting worse in HK & S'pore..
Malaysia might be next..
Face reality..we are nowhere near solving the Corona crisis..
Tourism related businesses are doomed..in 2020..

Hehe...

Posted by Daily8 > 2020-02-06 23:07 | Report Abuse

Cupcakes,, apa u cakap?

Itu orang British baru saja BREXIT perlu pakai duit. Sebab itu guna law sue orang Asia yang suka slang orang putih & kahwin orang Korea maybe suka sama Kpop Dan kimchi.

Posted by Cupcakes69 > 2020-02-06 23:12 | Report Abuse

@Daily8

Orang British teda sue orang Asia, dia orang sue Airbus, orang putih punya company. Jadi orang putih sue orang putih, bukan orang Asia yang suka ckp england dan mkn kimchi. AirAsia belum kena sue, masih investigating. Kalau kena sue juga, orang Malaysia yg sue.

Posted by probability > 2020-02-06 23:23 | Report Abuse

Look at the cost they incur for buying the planes from Airbus below:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AirAsia

On June 2011 AirAsia ordered 200 Airbus A320neos at the Paris Air Show.[67][68] The planes were originally due to become available in 2015, and the deal was one of the largest ever for commercial aircraft in a single order.[67] The deal was worth US$18 billion at list prices, although AirAsia will have obtained a substantial discount from those prices. The deal makes AirAsia Airbus' single biggest customer.

On 13 December 2012, AirAsia placed an order for an additional 100 Airbus A320 jets, splitting it between 64 A320neo and 36 A320ceo.[70] At the Farnborough International Air Show in 2016, Air Asia ordered 100 A321neos at an estimated cost of US$12.6 Billion dollars at list prices.

Air Asia plans to fly these larger aircraft to airports that have infrastructure constraints.[72] AirAsia received its first A320neo In September 2016.

With this, the total number of orders that AirAsia had placed for the Airbus A320 family had gone up to 575, reaffirming the carrier's position as the largest airline customer for the Airbus single aisle product line.[73]



(1) WHAT AIRBUS GAINS?
.......................


say Airbus hikes their margin by 0.5% by bribing TF and KM with US$ 50M:

Airbus cost of 300 Units: US$ 18B + US$ 12.6B = US$ 30.6B

Airbus gain:

= 0.5% x US$ 30.6 B
= RM 650 Million

Net Airbus gain:

= RM 650 Million - RM 200 M (bribery)
= RM 450 Milliom




(2) WHAT TF & KM GAINED?

.........................


What TF & KM gained from bribery of US$ 50M:

= RM 200 M

loss in AA with combined stake of 32%:

= 32% x 650 Million (cost hike)
= RM 210,000

Net gain by TF & KM:
= 200 - 210
= - 10 Million

...................

From the above, i cannot see any logic even if 100% of the bribery amount of 200 M went into their pocket...

will Airbus just for the sake RM 450M gain bribe RM 200M?
If Airbus benefited more by hiking more on their planes price....TF & KM will definitely suffer greater loss...

I hope the above rational, logical argument sinks to everyone's head.

==========================================================

Posted by Daily8 > 2020-02-06 23:33 | Report Abuse

Probability briilIant!

Posted by Daily8 > 2020-02-06 23:35 | Report Abuse

Oklah cupcakes69. Nanti kits tengok Korean drama Sambil minum corona makan sama popcorn kimchi

Posted by stockraider > 2020-02-06 23:36 | Report Abuse

Airasia whether good time or bad time always buy airbus & never other aircrafts all this while mah.....!!

Even airbus sponsorship of Tony & Kamaruddin company has no bearing on airasia buying decision mah...!!

Thus MACC no case loh...!!

Posted by newbie911 > Feb 6, 2020 10:33 PM | Report Abuse

Different business entity...how to offset.
Offset his head ah?
Anywhr...main motive is to make tony heart soft and slowly he has to agree with tun to merge with MAS.

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-06 23:47 | Report Abuse

Prime-minister-in-waiting Anwar Ibrahim said AirAsia would have to resolve the corruption case if the airline wanted to continue contending for a partnership.

"You can't expect us to consider an entity, when allegations are still there. They have to clear that first to be fair, otherwise we'll be seen to be complicit," he told Reuters in an interview on Thursday.

Posted by Cupcakes69 > 2020-02-06 23:49 | Report Abuse

@Daily8

Okey boss...can't wait lmao

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-06 23:49 | Report Abuse

I think as of now, MAS merger and digital banking license are dead...

Posted by Cupcakes69 > 2020-02-06 23:51 | Report Abuse

@probability

cool calculations..

"From the above, i cannot see any logic even if 100% of the bribery amount of 200 M went into their pocket..."

TM & KM incurs -10 mil if they took the bribe. However, If they somehow could take 200 mil directly from the company instead of the bribe, they would lose 64 mil (0.32 x RM200 mil), which is more than the RM10 mil lost. So taking the bribe would have cost them less. The worst thing is, whether they take the bribe or not, other investors will also lose value. At least Tony & KM has the RM200 mil to offset their losses.

"will Airbus just for the sake RM 450M gain bribe RM 200M?"
-Idk, but reports said that they did bribe a lot of airlines, not just airasia.

Posted by Cupcakes69 > 2020-02-06 23:52 | Report Abuse

@probability

Sry, had to delete my comment to fix a typo.

"I certainly agree Airbus bribed other Airline Chiefs...but not those who has the amount of stakes in the company like TF & KM."

I'm rooting for that too sir, hope they're innocent.

Posted by probability > 2020-02-06 23:52 | Report Abuse

I certainly agree Airbus bribed other Airline Chiefs...but not those who has the amount of stakes in the company like TF & KM.

...................

The stakes Directors have on the company matters & says a lot.



Posted by Cupcakes69 > Feb 6, 2020 11:51 PM | Report Abuse

@probability

cool calculations..

"From the above, i cannot see any logic even if 100% of the bribery amount of 200 M went into their pocket..."

TM & KM incurs -10 mil if they took the bribe. However, If they somehow could take 200 mil directly from the company instead of the bribe, they would lose 64 mil (0.32 x RM200 mil), which is more than the RM10 mil lost. So taking the bribe would have cost them less. The worst thing is, whether they take the bribe or not, other investors will also lose value. At least Tony & KM has the RM200 mil to offset their losses.

"will Airbus just for the sake RM 450M gain bribe RM 200M?"
-Idk, but reports said that they did bribe a lot of airlines, not just airasia.

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-06 23:53 | Report Abuse

Airbus only give offset to those with key decision making Who are they at AA?

Posted by Cupcakes69 > 2020-02-06 23:53 | Report Abuse

@probability

Sry, had to delete my comment to fix a typo.

"I certainly agree Airbus bribed other Airline Chiefs...but not those who has the amount of stakes in the company like TF & KM."

I'm rooting for that too sir, hope they're innocent.

Posted by stockraider > 2020-02-06 23:55 | Report Abuse

THE RISK OF AIRASIA RIGHT IS NOT THE BRIBERY CASE....BCOS DEFINITELY TONY & KAMAR WILL BE SUCCESSFUL IN THIS CASE LOH...!!

THE MAJOR RISK IS THE CONOVIRUS HAS DISRUPTED AIRASIA WORLDWIDE BUSINESS RIGHT NOW MAH...!!

Posted by stockraider > Feb 6, 2020 11:36 PM | Report Abuse X

Airasia whether good time or bad time always buy airbus & never other aircrafts all this while mah.....!!

Even airbus sponsorship of Tony & Kamaruddin company has no bearing on airasia buying decision mah...!!

Thus MACC no case loh...!!

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-07 00:02 | Report Abuse

This is very straight forward bride case thru sponsorship which now called offset. Kakaka...It depend how you spin like corruption become donation....

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-07 00:15 | Report Abuse

Airbus sudah cakap mau please itu TF and KM. That’s why kasi $$$ sponsor their F1 racing team supaya itu Aircraft deal boleh terus jalan kereta. Ada paham?

Posted by dragonslayer > 2020-02-07 00:23 | Report Abuse

faham

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-07 00:25 | Report Abuse

Because AA is one of the Malaysia asset and pride, Tun M got no choice, die die must protect it. If this happen to small Ikan bilis company, those culprits already being arrested long time...

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-07 00:26 | Report Abuse

So no worried lah. AA will survive and rise again...

Posted by probability > 2020-02-07 00:27 | Report Abuse

you guys still talking rubbish like bapuks liao.....

Airbus sold 575 planes to AA...do you know what is the value or not?

thats US$ 50 Billion.
.....................

what is US$ 50 Million vs US$ 50 Billion?

Thats exactly same like you treat your customer (4 or 5 people from the same company) for a RM 1000 lunch at a good chinese restraunt for an RM 1 Million order they placed for your product.

Its just damn 0.1% treat of the value of the product sold....

I used to have it every new year with my supplier. It develops good relationship and understanding for even negotiating the price when placing order

Posted by dragonslayer > 2020-02-07 00:32 | Report Abuse

faham

Posted by KAQ4468 > 2020-02-07 00:39 | Report Abuse

waaaaaa.... are u in procurement department ?

got kerja kosong now ? i'm looking for new job ...my company sudah mau kena jual ...kasi tolong sikit la ...kikikiiki








Posted by probability > Feb 7, 2020 12:27 AM | Report Abuse

I used to have it every new year with my supplier. It develops good relationship and understanding for even negotiating the price when placing order

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-07 00:39 | Report Abuse

When you caught by Malaysia police traffic, just treat him well and you can jalan kereta. Nothing wrong in Malaysia because is normal but in Singapore you try and see. So no need worried lah, can easily kau tim...

Posted by probability > 2020-02-07 00:45 | Report Abuse

If i am from Airbus with such a loyal customer....i will definitely feel obliged to treat them.

Business is not robotic decisions made purely based on numbers...there is a lot of human aspects to it....

what about service & maintenance support...how do you measure these?
you cannot use numbers (price) alone...

its about how quick they response with correct - precise solutions...instead of trial & errors...

these make a lot of difference on after sales.

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-07 00:47 | Report Abuse

Pls do not use ‘bride’ anymore. Now is called OFFSET......

Posted by JN88 > 2020-02-07 00:47 | Report Abuse

Sleep lo....you all buy somany airasia and chua sai until cant sleep ar???

Posted by Agjl > 2020-02-07 00:48 | Report Abuse

When we have a number in the countrt say its not bribe its offset. When he tell u black is white and white is black everyone just have to agree. Thats WHY AA price rebounded.

Good for those who bought earlier and happy that monied been make. No, i m not sour grape by staying sideline after cutting loss. I will just watch and see if what i feel is right...

Bribe, oh o mean offset is one thing...going forward as a company as a going concern is really a concern in my opinion. Even before this outbreak and offset issues, AA already registered losses. Ok, we may argue is a diferent accounting standard adopted. But is it really that?

I am not a smart so called investors even though i held AA for a good 6-7 years now. But this time i think something is terribly wrong. To thiose supporter, forgive me. I m too shallow to understand.

At the end of day, numbers will speak for itself. We will just wait for the numbers. And what kind of numbers are we looking at or hoping for? After worldwide industry come to a halt especially aviation. Cathay even ordered its 27.000 workers go on unpaid leave. Why? Becos airline is burning cash each day and need flight hours to make up the burn rate...

We just wait for the numbers....cheers

Posted by KAQ4468 > 2020-02-07 00:49 | Report Abuse

can't sleep la ... tonight Friday night

Posted by probability > 2020-02-07 00:50 | Report Abuse

and if i (Airbus) dont do it...my competitor (Boeing) will do...i really dont want that to happen....

I am 100% certain..the driving force...the sponsoring scheme was definitely initiated by Airbus instead of AirAsia....

as it is Airbus who is to gain from it.
.......................................

Posted by probability > 2020-02-07 00:58 | Report Abuse

...and please stop that nonsense on coronavirus as if you want dividend to be paid every quarter...and its causing end of the world

this virus implication to airlines is max 2 months (check what happen during SARS)..

that impatient meh? I think as investors one should not mind wait another 6 months....or even a year..when return is certain

even china airlines after complete halt share price only drop 16%
...........................................................

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-07 01:24 | Report Abuse

SARS only become infectious when you sick that’s why easily be detected and resolved in 2 months. But this Wuhan virus is different because virus carrier already start infectious before you sick. This is the reason why you see numbers of ppl infected now really crazy high. If not serious, China will not lockdown so many cities. Hope cure can be found soon. As long as no vaccine available, this issue still remain. Vaccine development take at least a year but fast track maybe 6 months hopefully...

Posted by probability > 2020-02-07 01:24 | Report Abuse

Other affected airlines at heart of the coronavirus area had barely dropped....WTF!


Air China Ltd: Peak of 8 to 6.90 : 13% drop

https://www.bloomberg.com/quote/753:HK

China Airlines Ltd: Peak of 9 to 8.3 : 7% drop

https://www.bloomberg.com/quote/2610:TT

China Southern Airlines Ltd: Peak 5.4 to 4.7: 13% drop

https://www.bloomberg.com/quote/1055:HK

Posted by probability > 2020-02-07 01:26 | Report Abuse

Betkaukau...check the recent finding...the asymptomatic spreading claimed earlier is now refuted by scientist.

Posted by Betkaukau > 2020-02-07 01:33 | Report Abuse

https://www.straitstimes.com/world/europe/wuhan-virus-coronavirus-spreading-in-munich-shows-difficulty-halting-new-bug

Posted by probability > 2020-02-07 01:36 | Report Abuse

the below is dated 5th Feb. Yours is end of Jan.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/02/05/health/wuhan-coronavirus-flawed-report/index.html

Posted by Zuliana > 2020-02-07 05:55 | Report Abuse

Beautiful day today?

Posted by i3lurker > 2020-02-07 06:13 | Report Abuse

https://www.thestar.com.my/news/world/2020/02/06/sri-lanka-arrests-airline-chief-over-airbus-kickback-claims

Posted by Joon Chan > 2020-02-07 06:19 | Report Abuse

Probability, got a few trolls just fuckin with you for the sake of fkin. its quite annoying.

If anyone wants to read the complete statement of facts :

https://we.tl/t-oyoTCAtvMY

I just found it insanely irresponsible for MACC, The Edge, the newspapers for blatantly misconstruing the first few articles.

It a serious matter, a lot of retailers hold this as an investment stock. Some with margin accounts and such. It's surely political la - some backdoor entry for a GLC position in AirAsia

Posted by EngineeringProfit > 2020-02-07 06:27 | Report Abuse

Agree

Posted by Joon Chan > 2020-02-07 06:30 | Report Abuse

wah timing is good too,
both founders are under the no-deal period pending the quarterly results
kena raid man..

Posted by ray1980 > 2020-02-07 06:34 | Report Abuse

More bad news announced from government.All China closed door city can't fly in our country.Not Wuhan line only.GG coming

Posted by ray1980 > 2020-02-07 06:37 | Report Abuse

The virus story need six to eight months to end.Malaysia economy must have big impacts on these cases

Posted by i3lurker > 2020-02-07 06:52 | Report Abuse

Guaranteed sure 8 months cannot end

Taxpayer will pay to rescue AA and MA

Govt. will increase personal tax rates or maybe a special tax will be imposed.

Posted by i3lurker > 2020-02-07 06:56 | Report Abuse

just buy

Khazanah will pump in few billion to rescue AA

Govt will call it too big to fail.

Posted by Joon Chan > 2020-02-07 06:59 | Report Abuse

lol 3b market cap, cheapest bailout

Posted by i3lurker > 2020-02-07 07:04 | Report Abuse

one route is RM5 Billion AA Samurai Bond, sure 100% Japan will reject.

reason is Japan Govt. will prefer Japan Airlines put money direct to AA.

Santan will serve sushi and sashimi thereafter