Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-13 17:07 | Report Abuse

@Patient Investor. Have you been to the previous AGMs? Can you share your experience with me?

Posted by JunHoHoHoHo > 2023-10-13 17:25 | Report Abuse

Positive change for Malaysian market 😅

https://www.thestar.com.my/business/business-news/2023/10/10/icapitalbiz039s-tan-teng-boo-bets-on-039positive-change039

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-13 17:27 | Report Abuse

TBH, If you have seen my earlier posts carefully, I am not against dividend plan. What is left out is another tool in the tool box that is SBB. We can declare dividend when the market function normally. Just like recent pullback, we should not buy back all. Declare dividend. But if there is sudden loss of confidence like dropping 15% in a week and that is 30-40% below NAV, we should do buy back. When it went up back to 20% and stabilizing, leave it alone. Like I said we are not interested to buy until zero discounts.

We also being poisoned because we equate SBB=COL. COL= Evil, therefore we automatically think SBB = evil. No mater how unhappy we are with COL, we should separate it as 2 issues. SBB is innocent.

My this morning post is saying even director or CDAM see iCAP is way below its intrinsic value and buy. I thank them. Give credit when credit is due.

In the past the issue, iCAP retain all the cash and let it compound. Therefore, SBB should not be considered. Now is different, iCAP is okay to allocate a fixed sum of cash to return to owners. Those smart owners will choose cash because they think we can manage their emotion and use it to buy in case share price below ex-dividend. But majority can't. People like you is probably is an above average skill investor. You can, other can't. I speak behalf on others that can't.

I am not interested in day to day price fluctuations or personal gains or losses. It's the governance issue. Also offer different perspective so that we don't follow blindly. This is the reason I appear in this forum.

I wan to guarantee you that if I put forward a motion, I will be voted down in AGM but it's okay. Let the voice be heard.

Posted by i3gambler > 2023-10-13 18:15 | Report Abuse

Share Buy Back and Cash Dividend (No DRIP) , will result in Total NAV shrinking, and therefore less annual fees.
No fund manager will like it,

For past 18 years, ICAP paid out 9.5 sen (13.3m）and 20 sen (28.0m) cash dividend.
The effect is not only on that year, buy every years after that,
Every year the fund manager will get less = (13.3m + 28.0m) * 1.5% = 620K.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-13 22:13 | Report Abuse

Public Enemy No 1? 😱

That's why I write the logics and hoping accidentally got masters with Mustang horsepower brains read it, pick it up and x tahan and help to speak on their behalf of those can't. Yesterday I said minority interest shareholder should help themselves ..... dream on... they can't.

Have you ever see a peasat dare to speak loudly to a master? They only bow silently. 😔

Posted by Patient Investor > 2023-10-14 09:15 | Report Abuse

@Fast I think SBB is a very common thought one would have, TTB will reply if you raise it in AGM, thats shareholders right and what AGM is for anyway.

One more reason I'm against share buy back, buy back shares is like increasing position in all the stocks within the portfolio for all shareholders.

While a dividend plan allows shareholders to decide, if you doesn't mind increasing overall position, you can use the dividend received to buy more icap shares, which is similiar to SBB which in a way contribute to narrowing the gap.

Lets assume there are 2 groups of shareholders:
A. Shareholders who doesnt mind the discount with a long term holding power, and probably accumulating at discount.
B. Shareholders who in hope the gap to close so they can sell

Now, If you belong to A, would you agree to use icap cash or even your own cash to close the gap for B to cash out at lower discount to NAV?
Hence I think the dividend plan is a more fair approach that balance both needs.

Thus far, the comments here mostly focus on the price gap, instead of looking at the holdings within and their potential. That's short term trader mindset instead of business owner mindset.

If the fund manager approach doest fit our investment goal, we should switch to another fund instead of hoping him to follow our instructions. Else would be better off just buy individual stocks ourself.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-14 11:12 | Report Abuse

@patient investor...Like you, if you followed my sparring sessions with @dumbMoney, I argued with him from the beginning that if iCAP buy back share, it will reduce the outstanding. And that will support the evil COL.

I even argued to the extreme that if iCAP used up all the $ 130 millions, it will help the evil COL trigger MGO, mandatory general offer.

That is only true when shares bought to cancel it but if is it distributed to shareholders, it will go back to original outstanding.

Illustration, there is 140 million shares outstanding, iCAP buys back 1 million share(at times of crisis) and keep it as treasury shares, if you use it to cancel yes, it will be reduced to 139 million shares but if you distribute this 1 million to shareholders, then it will go back to original 140 million. How dumb was I, making such a fundamental mistake.

Posted by i3gambler > 2023-10-14 11:39 | Report Abuse

Share Buy Back is a combination of the followings:
1) Give you Cash Dividend (No Drip)
2) Company to decide for you, when and at what price to buy additional ownership.

Too bad, no fund manager will like share buy back or cash dividend.
Because Total NAV will shrink.

TTB was already very kind to pay out 9.5 sen and 20 sen dividend.

My suggestion to TTB:
1) Go for right issue 1:1 at price 1.50
2) Use all the right issue money for Share Buy Back

Of course I don't know whether BURSA will approve or not such purpose of right issue. 😀😀

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-14 11:48 | Report Abuse

the fund manager should not be afraid of fees of which I think he rich enough not to be bothered. He is also capable to grow market cap to from current 300++ million cap to 1.5 billion. You do the math how much will he gets when it reach 1.5 billion. I am okay if keep 1.5% management fees because he help shareholders create almost 1.3 billion wealth.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-14 11:55 | Report Abuse

There is no denial that some companies abuse SBB that to a point we can argue it is a moral hazard. Top Glove for example, it has been goreng to a bubble level. When the bubble burst, the first thing the company did was to do SBB. ridiculous....they should not. In fact the minority shareholders should revolt. Call for an EGM, take the SBB away from them.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-14 12:13 | Report Abuse

The fund manager is an expert to determine when iCAP is way below its intrinsic value. Trust me, he will know it. He knows something look like a duck quack like a duck(iCAP is way below its intrinsic value). He invested on behalf of his clients CDAM and even director knows it, they stepped in to buy. I am merely pointing out iCAP PUT is a missing tool in the tool box. They are proposing dividend to be included in the tool box, I am fine with that except I don't support DRIP should be issued at a discounts, it is unfair to those accepted Cash dividend. It is a reward for those opt for DRIP but a punishment to Cash dividend holders. We know a lot of small holders will go for cash dividend because their holding is so small have a meaningful DRIP. It's equity logic here and I know between money and equity, in the proxy war, equity will be flushed out. I only bet on conscience and hopefully we have more people with conscience.

Many of iCAP followers follow the arguments that SBB will narrow or make discounts disappears in the past....I was away from iCAP for 10 years....I didn't have this historical baggage. I think we should erased this. SBB is innocent. Look at afresh again....

A rational fund manager will produce rational results....I felt he got a little past traumatic experience. Start afresh, aim for 1.5 market cap. Everybody wins. Please include the missing iCAP PUT tool, you don't have to use....just in case.

Posted by stockraider > 2023-10-14 12:14 | Report Abuse

Insas score all positive points as super investable stock when share price is still hanging below 90 sen loh!

FUNDAMENTAL FACTORS
1. It has a net cash of Rm 1.10 per share.
2. It trade at a PE of below 5x.
3. It has an NTA per share of Rm 3.43 per share.
4. If u add the potential mark to market gain of Inari & M&A, the revised Nta of insas exceed Rm 4.50 per share mah!.
5. It pays a dividend of 2.5 sen, that give a dividend yield of 2.82% pa, very close to the short term FD rates of 3.0% pa.
6. Insas has shown earnings sustainability & consistency as for the past 10 yrs, annually Insas has been reporting good profit n most amazingly every qtr for the past 10 yrs, Insas has been reporting positive positive every qtr loh!
7. If u invest in insas, U r exposing to the biggest tech listed Composite Index co in KLSE-Inari.
8. U r also deriving the best manage Finance Co in KLSE by investing in insas mah!

GORENG FACTORS
9. Insas own the most efficient goreng corp finance listed co in klse-M&A
10. Insas is due to be goreng bcos its share price at 88.5 sen now is close to the exercise price of the warrant at 90 sen mah!
11. The insas chart indicate Insas is due to breakout of 90 sen & powerfully will go above Rm 1.20 soon loh!
12. Insas is one of the most promising incubators & its Venture capital has been performing very well loh!

Do not missed this INSAS high positive profitability potential, INVEST NOW LOH!

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-14 12:25 | Report Abuse

I will be away for a business trip....I won't be able to participate for a while......see you all a bit later.

Posted by Patient Investor > 2023-10-14 16:59 | Report Abuse

@FastMoney what's the purpose of buying back share from shareholders(who is looking to sell), and distribute it to shareholders(who is looking to hold long)?

How would it benefit shareholders who plans to hold long as compare to a dividend payout which shareholders can decide if to buy more from those who want to unload?

Posted by dumbMoney > 2023-10-14 17:28 | Report Abuse

Readers here can work out how a 4% cash dividend on the assumption that the shares are trading at a 24% price discount compares against the same amount of cash used to do a SBB at the same 24% discount from the market and then distributing these shares as share dividend to the remaining shareholders? Shareholders can then make their own informed decisions.

Posted by dumbMoney > 2023-10-15 06:11 | Report Abuse

These are my computations under various assumptions and alternatives Paying dividends either in cash or shares have no effect on shareholders' wealth, but a SBB increases the NAV of the remaining shares, depending on the amount of SBB and the price discount. https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/y8sacaao3nejubp1owmor/iCap-dividend-policy-alternatives.xls?rlkey=nf1d2ldsdu5m6cuq5m38nj2lq&dl=0

Posted by dumbMoney > 2023-10-15 06:16 | Report Abuse

SBB redistributes the money left behind on the table from the sellers at a discount to the remaining share holders with the discount then accruing to their shares, i.e less men more share.

Posted by Patient Investor > 2023-10-15 09:53 | Report Abuse

@dumbMoney SBB and distribute to shareholders wont increase NAV unless the SBB goal is to narrow the NAV discount. and what's the point of narrowing NAV if not doing a favour for those who wish to sell their holdings?

Posted by stockraider > 2023-10-15 10:08 | Report Abuse

Any future dividend projected to be paid base on formula by icap management, will be a improvement to ICAP corp governance, surely an improvement in Corp governance will worth some rerating for icap loh!

Also for icap management for their own benefit as well, it is of importance to narrow the discount gap further, that will mean that there will be less cash outflow to be made for div payment, thus share buy back is another important tool to be looked at loh!

Do not discount the power of share buy back mah!

Posted by i3gambler > 2023-10-15 11:54 | Report Abuse

Let say there are Mr.A and Mr.B, each own 1.40m units ICAP or in term of ownership percentage it is 1.0%.

1) After ICAP bought back 10% or 14m units at market price 2.68, spent about 37.52m, total outstanding units become 126m.

Mr.A decide to maintain 1.0% ownership, then he need to sell 0.14m units, so that he will now own 1.26m units, and the sale proceeds = 2.68*0.14m = 375.2K, it is just like a cash dividend for him.

Mr.B does not want to sell, he keep holding 1.40m units, and ownership will increase to 1.1111%. It is just like he receive cash dividend and use the money to buy more units.

Distributing the treasury units is just a mini scale of bonus issue, meaningless and it is creating odd lot / troublesome for all the small unit holders. For good company like BKAWAN, they just burn all the 44m treasury shares in June 2020.

2) If ICAP pay cash dividend instead of SBB, spent the same 37.52m, or DPS=37.52m/140m = 0.268.

Mr.A decide to maintain 1.0% ownership, he just take and keep the cash dividend = 1.4m*0.268 =375.2K.

Mr.B want to have higher ownership in term of ownership = 1.1111%, then he need to use the cash dividend 375.2K and buy extra 155556 units from open market. The ex-Dividend price should be = 2.68 - 0.268 = 2.412, so the purchase cost = 155556*2.412 = 375.2K, exactly equal to the cash dividend amount that Mr.B received.


My conclusion, SBB and Cash Dividend, they are 99% the same.

But practically SBB is better than Cash Dividend in reducing the Price/NAV gap.
Because other than Mr.A and Mr.B, there are also many passive Mr.C, they do nothing when SBB, and also do nothing when receive cash dividend.

Posted by dumbMoney > 2023-10-15 14:46 | Report Abuse

@Patient Investor COL is only one of the 3000 plus shareholders. You cannot have it both ways, keep the discount high to prevent COL from sell and take profit, they will keep buying and make management nervous of being kicked out. At the same time, you are also trapping all the other shareholders who want to exit, but get locked in because of the deep discount and they make noise . When the shares were trading at all time high recently, did COL take profit at the opportunity? It is other shareholders who were selling. So to fight COL, other shareholders become collatral damage, trapped by the perennial discount, is that fair?

Posted by Patient Investor > 2023-10-15 15:03 | Report Abuse

@dumbMoney Personally, it's not about fighting COL. but i dont see the rational of using funds from long term holder to fulfil those who want to exit. isnt a dividend payment more fair? Those who seeking exit can use the dividend receive to buy icap shares to close the gap and see if they can exit by then.

Posted by dumbMoney > 2023-10-15 15:04 | Report Abuse

It is like the Middle East now, to punish Hamas for the incursion, Israel is punishing all the Gaza residents. This is punishing all the other shareholders to prevent COL from taking profit and exiting. The fund manager don't care because the fees are based on NAV, not price, so even at 40% discount, is not their problem. So now, every year, management got to spend money (not sure who is paying, CDAM or iCap?) on road shows and investor days to drum up support ahead of the AGM. Once the trapped stale bulls get fed up with the impasse, they may switch loyalty. According to the shareholders list, there are plenty of big investors who have kept the same number of shares for the past 10 years with nothing much to show other than the 2 dividends paid. These are the management's supporter base, don't antagonise them. From the price action seen so far, the dividend policy bullet has been fired and looks like a blank, investor days and road shows are old hat by now. Take COL to court again over the foreign shareholding limit? Shareholders have yet to be informed how much the previous futile attempts have cost them.

Posted by Patient Investor > 2023-10-15 15:32 | Report Abuse

@i3gambler
In SBB scenario, there's transaction cost incurred and doesnt put any cash into shareholders had, if mr.A sell, it will widen nav discount.
In Dividend scenario Mr.B buying lower supply in market if not narrowing the NAV gap.


also if mr.A sell, the share price will went down further and widen NAV discount.

Posted by dumbMoney > 2023-10-15 15:52 | Report Abuse

The proper motivation for a SBB program is to moderate the selling pressure from irrational sellers who want to exit at any price, i.e. just throw the shares in the market, never to prop up the share price. As a long term value investor, with enough faith in the future prospects of the company, the cheaper the SBB prices, the better for the remaining shareholders. I have been in the broking business before. You don't show your volume buying bids on the board, just pick up shares from the sellers if the aim is to collect cheap shares. Too many companies have been doing SBB to support or push up their share price, that's share price rigging, different from what we are discussing here. There is never justification to do SBB at 10 x book value, like what Top Glove did, the example often cited here to show why SBB is no good. But no one mentioned the SBB by WB, even by those that quote him all the time.

Posted by dumbMoney > 2023-10-15 15:56 | Report Abuse

https://ycharts.com/companies/BRK.A/stock_buyback

Posted by JohnD0ugh > 2023-10-16 00:02 | Report Abuse

Since its inception in 2005, ICAP has been trading at a premium to NAV in the first 3 years, as almost 100% of its share owners were individuals.

The share price subsequently traded at a persistent discount due to the irresponsible behavior of a few large parties, who want to wreck ICAP for their own short-term gains.

In order to address its share owners' concern of share price discount, the fund manager has come out with long-term strategies and campaigns to attract the right quality of share owners.

Ever since the nationwide roadshow conducted in Jul 2023 where several possible scenarios of ICAP were proposed and discussed, the market has shown very positive reaction. As at 3 Oct 2023, ICAP's share price has surged 26.92% since Jul (first roadshow took place on 1 Jul).

The most innovative dividend policy

On 29 Sep 23, ICAP announced its unique dividend policy that aims to narrow the gap between its share price and NAV and possibly move it back to parity or premium to its NAV.

We believe it is the first ever closed-end fund anywhere in the world that has adopted such an innovative dividend policy.

This unique dividend policy is formulated based on the aggregate of 1% of the NAV per Share (Base Rate) plus 8% of the difference in the market price of ICAP Shares and the NAV per Share (Top-up Rate). The Top-up Rate will not apply if the share price is trading at parity or a premium to NAV.

Under normal market and economic conditions, the expected dividend yield will be approximately 4%, which will be paid on a yearly basis.

From 2002 to 2022, the average 3-month fixed deposit rate in Malaysia was 2.80%; the average 3-month Malaysian Treasury Bill was 2.76%; and the average dividend yield based on the Kuala Lumpur Composite Index was 3.20%.

This suggests that the expected dividend yield of 4% is attractive. Thanks to this well-designed innovative dividend policy, ICAP remains a long-term capital appreciation fund that aims at achieving superior long-term compound return.

At the same time, a dividend reinvestment plan (DRP) will be implemented to provide greater flexibility to share owners in meeting their investment objectives.

The dividend entitlement can either be received wholly in cash, or be reinvested in new ICAP Shares at an issue price to be determined by the Board.

The DRP enlarges the issued share capital, which increases its liquidity and hence reduces the chances of share price manipulation by certain large institutional parties. On top of this, shareholders will be exposed to further capital appreciation when reinvestment option is elected.

With the Base Rate tied to ICAP's NAV, what this means is that investors who buy ICAP shares now will be able to enjoy a dividend that will be consistently rising at a compound rate.

Say ICAP's NAV doubles to RM7.16. The 1% Base Rate component of ICAP's dividend will then produce a dividend payment of 7.16 sen, double the present dividend payment of 3.56 sen.

If the NAV doubles in 5 years, your dividend payment and dividend yield doubles in 5 years. And it has no impact on ICAP's long-term capital appreciation objective. Except for the 2 pandemic years, the 1% Base Rate is below the average interest and dividend income streams that ICAP has received annually since 2006. In addition, the DRP will cater to the needs of the Top-up Rate.

This is how innovative ICAP's dividend policy is.

This innovative dividend policy and DRP is the result of extensive research conducted by Capital Dynamics and Tan Teng Boo. To appreciate its full benefits, come to ICAP's AGM and listen to an international finance expert, Dr Lorenzo, together with Tan Teng Boo, explain this unique dividend policy on Saturday, 4th Nov 2023. Dr Lorenzo will also present his independent research and assessment of ICAP's NAV and share price performance at the 2023 Investor Day on Sunday, 5th November, at the KL Convention Centre.


i Capital Newsletter Volume 35 Issue 9

Posted by Integrity. Intelligent. Industrious. 3iii (iiinvestsmart)$€£¥ > 2023-10-17 12:35 | Report Abuse

>>>
JohnD0ugh

Since its inception in 2005, ICAP has been trading at a premium to NAV in the first 3 years, as almost 100% of its share owners were individuals.

The share price subsequently traded at a persistent discount due to the irresponsible behavior of a few large parties, who want to wreck ICAP for their own short-term gains.

>>>

Many indivdual investors are novices. They do not know the difference between price and value.

The price of iCAP started to trade at a discount following the 2008 Global Financial Crisis. It continues to trade at a discount since that time. This is not unexpected.

What pained the shareholders of iCAP was the very steep discount of its share price to its NAV for a long period of time.

Posted by i3gambler > 2023-10-17 16:13 | Report Abuse

ICAP NAV grew at 7.82% p.a. since inception.

But he said "If the NAV doubles in 5 years, your dividend payment and dividend yield doubles in 5 years."

To double in 5 years, you need 14.87%,
Almost double of the historical 7.82%.

Posted by kukubird27 > 2023-10-17 20:23 | Report Abuse

My impression is this: I still remember before 2010, you could see advertisements in local newspapers mentioning that ICAP could achieve an annual interest rate of 15%, based on the performance of several previous virtual/offline Icapital related funds. Afterwards, you may notice that the TTB says about 10-12%, not 15% anymore. Later, he said it was about 8% higher than the Kuala Lumpur Stock Exchange. Finally, is better than FD and you will not lose due to price trade below NAV,something like that. Therefore, I believe the price is below NAV because investors are disappointed with TTB's performance from 2009-202x

Now he says the current trend is good and even hinted that a 15% return could be achieved. But I doubt one thing. He said that the United States is in big trouble, but it will not affect the entire world because we has China. Don’t you remember that he mentioned similar things before 2010? It affected ICAP's performance in subsequent years. So, will he be right this time? Or TTB make the same mistake again in the next five years?
I think his proclivity toward China is causing problems

Many years ago TTB mention if Nestle drop to 2x or 3x, he will buy, at that time seem like Nestle above 100. Just curious how come 2009 he not change those rubbish ICAP counter such as Pakson to Nestle counter or other blue chip counter, if not no need to wait next 5 years, now NAV should be more than 6. We all should know blue chip will first recovery. Then mention what MYEG already know earlier just don't want what relationship politic bla bla bla.

I've held ICAP since 2009, and as a long-term investor, it's not the fact that its share price trades at a steep discount to its net asset value that pains me. What pains me is 15% before 2009, but drop to now single digit %. If TTB can achieve 12-15%, I don't mind keep waiting to grow my money even no dividend. But the problem is performance keep dropping. If an investor buy ICAP on "stock price" 2.0 in 2010, and now 2023, NAV is 3.5, his compound % from price 2.0 to current NAV 3.5 only 5.2%, better than FD only. I check Warren Buffect same period, he can achieve 11.52%. We need to know not everybody bought it before 2006-2008 or when ICAP price 1.19 in 2009.

2008 Jan NAV 2.24
2009 Jan NAV 1.57
2010 Jan NAV 2.08
2023 Oct NAV 3.54

So we can sit and see for next 6 years, whether he fail again? And cause ICAP only can compete with FD rate? or "this time not same?". But I already made my decision what to do if price and NAV come close. He blame what London XXX, but for me, his bad performance is root of everything,

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 10:59 | Report Abuse

“You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.”
― Abraham Lincoln

Posted by MG9231 > 2023-10-18 12:05 | Report Abuse

TTB's style, you leave your money for him to put in FD n he earns your management fees so long as Icap Bhd under his control and not liquidated. Brilliant!

Posted by dumbMoney > 2023-10-18 13:44 | Report Abuse

Most funds would add the disclaimer that past performance is no guarantee for future success, just in case they over promise and under deliver.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 14:25 | Report Abuse

That control has been a talk of the town when I pointed Tan Mun Ling is someone is working in CDAM. I need to go through the annual report and see.. Whoever has more information, please share.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 14:26 | Report Abuse

Is the board really independent?

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 14:29 | Report Abuse

Also been warned that I am a wanted man, can appear on a big presentation screen as public enemy #1. Don't appear.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 15:54 | Report Abuse

TAN MUN LIN
• Non-Independent Non–Executive Director
• Member of the Nomination Committee (“NC”)
• Aged 36, Malaysian, Female
Ms Tan Mun Lin was appointed to your Board of Directors
on 11 January 2021. She holds the Capital Markets Services
Representative Licence issued by the Securities Commission
of Malaysia (SC) and is licensed as a representative by the
Securities and Futures Commission of Hong Kong (SFC), both
for the regulated activity of fund management.

Ms Tan is a fund manager and Executive Director of Capital
Dynamics Asset Management Sdn Bhd. She also serves as
the deputy group CEO of Capital Dynamics, an investment
advisory and fund management group licensed by the SC, the
Monetary Authority of Singapore, the Australian Securities and
Investments Commission and the SFC.

Ms Tan has more than 14 years of experience in the
regulated investment advisory and fund management
industry. She possesses extensive experience in local and
global investment research and analysis, legal, regulatory
& compliance, marketing/business development, HR,
operations, strategy and management.
Ms Tan started her career in Capital Dynamics as Executive
Assistant to CEO (Investment Research) in September 2009.
She graduated with Bachelor of Commerce and Bachelor of
Laws from the University of Sydney in 2009.

Ms Tan Mun Lin has no family relationship with any director or
major shareholder of your Fund nor has any possible conflict
of interest with your Fund save as disclosed that she is also
the Executive Director of your Fund Manager. She has not
been convicted of any offence (other than traffic offence, if
any) within the past five (5) years nor any public sanctions
or penalty imposed by relevant regulatory bodies during
the financial year. She attended six (6) Board of Directors’
Meetings held in the financial year ended 31 May 2023.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 15:55 | Report Abuse

2023 Annual Report page 36

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 16:01 | Report Abuse

Annual Report 2023, page 59
22. CAPITAL DYNAMICS ASSET MANAGEMENT SDN BHD 1,161,500
30. CAPITAL DYNAMICS ASSET MANAGEMENT SDN BHD 937,900

I smell rats, they have something to hide.

Your fund manager company CDAM accumulated 1.4 millions shares..or 1.4% control now.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 16:02 | Report Abuse

Why 2 lines?

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 16:09 | Report Abuse

I have reasons to believe the numbers are getting higher than this, accumulating more after 23/08/23...Let's wait for 1 more year and see.

Posted by Patient Investor > 2023-10-18 17:21 | Report Abuse

@FastMoney The vast majority of Buffett's net worth is tied to Berkshire Hathaway, his publicly traded holding and investment company. Buffett owns about 38% of the company's Class A shares and less than 0.001% of Class B shares, according to the Bloomberg Billionaires index.

What's your concern?

If they got something to hide, why would they wanna hide it under the name of CDAM sdn bhd?

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 17:32 | Report Abuse

I am merely a normal novice investor, explain to all why 2 lines? Please do not pass the bucks to me

Posted by fairplay > 2023-10-18 18:27 | Report Abuse

Bad experience in empty promise of FM. At road show, FM defend iCap not practicing SBB on view that an annual 10 per cent share buy-back may have temporary and limited market price support. My view us that FM is more interested to Collect professional fees than looking after the interests of shareholders. Are the shareholders of Blue chip companies dumb to support Share Buy-Back schemes, if there are no advantages in such, especially when market price is at large discount to intrinsic value?

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-18 21:07 | Report Abuse

Throughout the period as a shareholder, when I received iCAP annual report, it will left unopened. After a while, it would go into rubbish bin. Simple, I trust the fund manager, no need to read them. Recently, I begin to read the again because I felt there are some truths in what people complaints. Fees for example, many talked about %, too abstract. But I was shocked to find out in real money, shareholders paid about RM $ 78 million fees while market cap increase about RM 80 million. Being generous inclusive of 4% share price jumped today. All the answer we get is I am a victim, blame the penjajah kulit putih.......shareholders would expect a minimum of apology. It looks like more and more like the old government masking the performance issue with 3Rs issue.

Year ***Fund Management Fee*** Investment advisory Fee***Total
2012****2,894,863 **** 2,894,863 **** 5,789,726
2013**** 3,089,891 *********** 3,089,891********** 6,179,782
2014**** 3,109,491******** 3,109,491*********** 6,218,982
2015**** 3,187,354******** 3,187,354********** 6,374,708
2016**** 3,075,342******* 3,075,342 ********** 6,150,684
2017***** 3,263,523****** 3,263,523********** 6,527,046
2018***** 3,592,787****** 3,592,787 ******** 7,185,574
2019***** 3,596,061****** 3,596,061******* 7,192,122
2020***** 3,329,391****** 3,329,391****** 6,658,782
2021***** 3,033,182****** 3,033,182***** 6,066,364
2022***** 3,562,242****** 3,562,242****** 7,124,484
2023***** 3,455,641****** 3,455,641****** 6,911,282
Total 78,379,536

Market Cap 2012 308,000,000
Market Cap 2023 392,000,000
Change 84,000,000

Posted by EngineeringProfit > 2023-10-18 21:08 | Report Abuse

Very nice report I rcvd.
Nicest ever

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-19 18:20 | Report Abuse

****Correction*** To be fair to the fund manager, I should add back RM 28 million on the dividend declared in year 2021, hence the incremental value created = RM 84 million + RM 28 million = RM 112 million for the RM 78 million fees received. Fair is fair. My apology for the oversight.

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-19 20:56 | Report Abuse

I have some questions to ask if someone is holding shares under nominee account of a stock broker or CDAM. Are they a member of a company? Can they vote in the coming AGM?

Posted by FastMoney666 > 2023-10-19 21:31 | Report Abuse

Found additional information about CDAM.

https://www.cdam.biz/board-of-directors/

1. Tan Teng Boo. MD of CDAM
2. Dr. Tunku Sara Binti Tunku Ahmad Yahya. She has 2.6 million shares in iCap
3. Tan Yuen-Lin. He is the son of TTB
4. Tan Mun Ling. Executive Director and Fund Manager.

TTB has direct interest of 65,000 shares and 2.9 million indirect interest via Capital Dynamics Asset Management Sdn. Bhd., Capital Dynamics Global Private Limited, Capital Dynamics Sdn. Bhd. and his sister-in-law, Fong San Lai pursuant to Section 8(4) of the Companies Act 2016 (the Act).

https://www.bursamalaysia.com/market_information/announcements/company_announcement/announcement_details?ann_id=3389629

They have been actively buying shares including for private clients but refused to accept mandate to do SBB on behalf of iCAP shareholders. Why? Open to all for comments.

Posted by Patient Investor > 2023-10-19 22:07 | Report Abuse

@Fast Your questioning on how much icap make in management fee vs shareholder gain is valid, I feel the same too when I do first do the calculation.
but first do you think most fund manager will lose money when market in bear? If you can provide a valid comparison to other Malaysia funds, maybe can convince maangement to take a cut in fee %.
second is the comparison is since 2012 instead inception. Since inception Shareholder Equity gain is ~345million vs total fee charge ~93 million.

What's your concern about TTB holding icap shares through another company, do you prefer your fund manager to have or dont have skin in the fund? Buffet has a very high stake of his wealth tied Berkshire. When he buy shares, he is helping in closing NAV gap, without lowering the cash warchest of icap which can be deploy in future. SBB will lower cash holdings.

Are you still collecting? or just holding becoz its lower than NAV?
Will you be attending AGM and ask the question about SBB? asking here no use, TTB wont answer here.