Posted by bsngpg > 2013-10-02 12:48 | Report Abuse

newbiestockreturns: pls elaborate and provide rational. Do not simply throw in a bomb. Thks.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-10-02 12:52 | Report Abuse

Posted by bsngpg > Oct 2, 2013 12:11 PM | Report Abuse
Hi KC: I knew your intrinsic value on KFima, no question on it. However I would very much appreciate to hear your risk assessment on KFima. Thks.

bsngpg, i am just a retail investor. I ain't a professional analyst nor working with any investment bank. As a matter of fact, I have never worked in the industry before. So I am not "know all" person.

However, if you are more specific on your question, for example what specific risk you are talking about, and if I know anything or have any opinion at all, I am glad to offer.

Posted by iafx > 2013-10-02 13:04 | Report Abuse

bsngpg's questions r the same time the answer; no pushing ball , smart fellow :)

Posted by calvintaneng > 2013-10-02 13:12 | Report Abuse

I like kcchongnz quotation from Philip Fisher, "The stock market is filled with individuals who know the price of everything, but the value of nothing."

KFima was our great buy in 2008 when we got it at 35 Cts only. After 5 short years KFima has gone up 6 Fold at RM2.00.

Going Forward KFima will stagnate at RM2.00 unless Palm Oil prices rebound. While waiting why not consider PM Corp(4081) Like KFima in 2008 It has the potential to rise more than 6 fold!

PM Corp has high NTA, is Cash Rich, a Recession proof business & Best of all - PM Corp is going to give a Cash Pay Out Soon.

Happy Investing!

Posted by bsngpg > 2013-10-02 13:29 | Report Abuse

Hi KC: I love my wife very much but I knew she is imperfect i.e. she is not a daughter of a rich man(ha! ha!). I would like to hear from you any negative elements(or potential negative) of KFima. I think this is very helpful to educate members to assess a company from both +ve and -ve sides.
Thks.

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 13:37 | Report Abuse

there is this bunch of guys in a party... then comes a nice sexy lady and the guys focus on her all of them trying to court her.. each men has the intention of getting laid...but this hot sexy girl cannot be courted.. those guys dont recognize that until they all go home empty handed... guys go home without getting laid cos they were focus on that hot chick but they forgot about all the average girls in the room...other average girls would have followed them back home and they would have gotten laid...

KCChongnz is that guys who focus on the hot girl in the room but never gets laid...

get the story with respect to KFIMA...

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 13:39 | Report Abuse

KFIMA has gone up.. that is about all it will ever go.... dont be distracted holding on to a stock that is crap... buy stocks that will go up.. much much more... that is stock market.. about making money in long and short term.. NOT PICKING the best stocks with PE and the rest.... GET IT>>> KCCHONGNZ dont get it.. STOP WASTNG time...

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 13:40 | Report Abuse

STOP THIS wasting time on stocks that dont go up... BUY STOCK THAT DO...

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 13:41 | Report Abuse

KFIMA=PN17 sooner rather than later...

Posted by bsngpg > 2013-10-02 13:46 | Report Abuse

KC: thousands sorry for pulling in so much of negative elements. Sorry.

Posted by Ooi Teik Bee > 2013-10-02 14:00 | Report Abuse

Posted by newbiestockreturns > Oct 2, 2013 01:41 PM | Report Abuse

KFIMA=PN17 sooner rather than later...

Ans : I agreed with you that it is a down trending stock, hence it is not able to make money from this stock.
I am willing to bet to my last cent that this stock cannot be classified as a PN17 stock. Please talk with fact.
Thank you.

Posted by KAHFIEHLAI > 2013-10-02 14:01 | Report Abuse

Posted by newbiestockreturns > Oct 2, 2013 01:39 PM | Report Abuse KFIMA has gone up.. that is about all it will ever go.... dont be distracted holding on to a stock that is crap... buy stocks that will go up.. much much more... that is stock market.. about making money in long and short term.. NOT PICKING the best stocks with PE and the rest.... GET IT>>> KCCHONGNZ dont get it.. STOP WASTNG time...

Newbaby..why dont u comment those easy making $$$$ stocks here for us....see how accurate n easy...i predict u kena tembak teruk nanti ....

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 14:02 | Report Abuse

thanks bsngpg for bringing the truth out about KFIMA and KC

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 14:03 | Report Abuse

kahfielai u fool.. remember HLIND????? go and read up on HLIND.. how many more stocks u want me to predict ler.... LOL.. i keep to myself la.. cos here only guys who never get laid ler.. LOL

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 14:04 | Report Abuse

u want a stock name that will go up... RHBCAP....

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 14:05 | Report Abuse

SELL KFIMA... BUY RHBCAP

Posted by gark > 2013-10-02 14:07 | Report Abuse

BSNGPG : In fact plantation is NOT Kfima's competitive advantage, although it contribute 30% of revenue/profits.

KFima's MOAT is in Bulking and Security printing.

For bulking facility, a ship will often offload chemicals into a bulking tank very fast as temporary storage, this is done so that the ship does not have to wait in port too long and incur heavy demmurage charges. The reverse is also true when exporting liquids .The liquid product is then deliver/recieve using conventional trucks. Major customers of Kfima's bulking facility include palm oil refinery, oil and gas, latex & other chemicals. Kfima's bulking facility is located in Penang port and West port, and they are the only such facility at these port. Income will be from rental of tank and/or throughput calculations. Overhead cost are low, and since no competitors at these particular port, they are essentially toll collector. Kfima has been building new tanks continuously since the last 5 year.

For security printing, they own 20% of G&S which is responsible for printing the new malaysian currency. Other security documents include bank cheques, confidential documents. govt documents etc. Many people do not know that Finance ministry have 1 GOLDEN share in the security printing bussiness. This assure they will have continuous monopoly (otherwise the top secret documents will leak out).

Canning contributes only the other 10% of profits, not exciting but growing at a reasonable rate. in 1H13 they have begun canning tuna to export to Europe under OEM trademark. Last time they only do sardines.

Posted by KAHFIEHLAI > 2013-10-02 14:12 | Report Abuse

Oic ..let have look and try it out.tk ok

Posted by newbiestockreturns > 2013-10-02 14:14 | Report Abuse

SELL KFIMA... BUY RHBCAP

Posted by gark > 2013-10-02 14:17 | Report Abuse

Oh yeah security printing business also print all your passport, IC and driving license as well. So have to thank you all for contributing to KFima's business. :)

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-10-02 14:31 | Report Abuse

Posted by iafx > Oct 2, 2013 01:04 PM | Report Abuse
bsngpg's questions r the same time the answer; no pushing ball , smart fellow :)

bsngpg is definite a smart fellow, asking intelligent questions. Don't just take others opinions as face value. Very polite and courteous man.

This is unlike some people, especially this one who has nothing, absolutely nothing except accusing others copy and paste, tipu-pusing, bullshit, cheating without a single substantiation. Even accusing me of cheating about changing that "profit" into "revenue" when he is the one who altered the word, on the same thread here. Calling calvin the PM Corp guy a "black sheep" when calvin took so much effort explaining why PM Corp is a good investment, which I fully agreed. Really have no shame at all.

Ok let's get back to business to bsngpg.

Negative elements? I am already given my opinions on your first three. You want me to speculate some more of its negative elements? That Kfima will lose its security printing business, and its palm oil plantation may get disease and whole crop wiped out? Again, I have no crustal ball to tell me.

Okok, let me give my opinions on your the other post below:

Posted by bsngpg > Oct 2, 2013 12:24 PM | Report Abuse
Hi: I have another probable negative element on KFima for your comment. It is the non core competency on its biz. Nowadays the globalization turns biz world to very competitive. Only those with competitive edge can last long and win but not dick, tom and Harry. So what is KFima's competitive edge ? Plantation? Nope. Food industry? Nope. Bulking? Nope. Security printing? Yes in M'sia due to its special connection to the government. But how far can this biz grows?

As you know the main business of Kfima is security manufacturing and printing, palm oil and bulking. We just ignore others which are small relatively but if you look into them in more details, they are actually growing and provide positive return to the company.

Do you need any advance competency to involve in palm oil? Years ago, when Kfima started to deal in the palm oil industry, there were many skeptics. I would be one of them if I knew about it because Kfima had no experience at all. Now palm oil already constitute 30% of its net income. The revenue, income and profit has been consistent. Do you know that last year when palm oil price was low, many plantation company lost money? Do you know that Kfima's revenue and profit the last quarter actually increased?

Will Kfima lose its contract with Bank Negara and other banks? How the hell I know?

Posted by Reno Wong > 2013-10-02 14:46 | Report Abuse

Judging from how frequent, extreme and one-sided newbiestockreturns replies you can easily tell that he is nuts and childish. No point in wasting time debate with him as he seems like just getting mad because of losing money from this counter. I happened to buy both RHBCAP and KFIMA last 2 week because they are both cheapest and experiencing selling pressure just because of lower profit these days. Again as i've mentioned earlier, Kfima is using only half of their assets to generate this level of profit, with huge pile of cash sitting idle that means they have potential to expand aggresively in future. by excluding the cash pile from calculation, their ROE is around 20%. I am not sure about what the management thinking but they are currently at defensive mode or either waiting for worthy acquisition. either way, considering low CPO price and cash reservation that KFIMA have, I believe it is undervalued.

Posted by gark > 2013-10-02 14:59 | Report Abuse

Kfima has a vary bad period in 1999, in which their brokerage business almost brought them to bankruptcy, at the time it was heavily leveraged with lots debt. Due to this scare, Kfima has been very conservative ever since as the near death experience taught them a lesson in debts.

Posted by bsngpg > 2013-10-02 15:08 | Report Abuse

newbiestockreturns : relay to your story on a hot sexy girl above, 1.37pm, 2 Oct13.

I am a seasoned guy having many average girls as girl friend before and even having some on hand now, thus I am now not interested to court for another average girl. That is why I willingly try my very best to court for the hot sexy girl who seldom appears in the party. Even though at the end I go home with empty hand, at least I enjoy the process and that moment.

Since courting a hot sexy girl is a challenge and big fun, I share with members that she is hot and sexy and welcome them to join the game if they want to. But if they disagree and see that hot sexy girl as a Pig, it s fine too, there is no force and no harm, and they have full freedom to court for average girls and whoever.
Do you agree?

Posted by anbz > 2013-10-02 16:44 | Report Abuse

marry...don't simpan or have freesex...lu kena aids nanti ...or other bad symptoms...if u use rubbers...still u will pay the consequences ...

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-10-02 17:59 | Report Abuse

Hey anbz, well said.

But if you dabble in NovaMsc, a stock whose company is making losses every year and the major shareholders/management all digging into its shallow coffer, after the fun, if any, you will also exposed to this serious disease too.

Posted by KAHFIEHLAI > 2013-10-02 21:23 | Report Abuse

wow...we seeking $$$ here and now + sexy girls again..U guy are the most lucky....kena ~~ pun tidak apalah. So what u think later u will get thing u want. gd luck

Posted by bsngpg > 2013-10-02 21:45 | Report Abuse

Rubbish and Pariah
Hi KC Chong : This afternoon, I went to a very good restaurant for a high value food. We use parking coupon in our town. After scratching and placing the coupon on dashboard, I stepped out from the car. Wah! out of sudden there was a gangster asking for parking money. In order to avoid trouble I gave him RM0.50, maybe it was too penny to him, he used dirty language. I was upset and almost want to fight back, but at the end I did not. Because I thought if I fought back, then I lower down myself to his rubbish pariah level. So I decided to forgo the value lunch and drove away. Did you faced with this kind of unpleasant experience too ?

Posted by anbz > 2013-10-02 23:50 | Report Abuse

confirmed wa sudah kena sama kcchong..haha...but not sure if bsnG--P--G...satirizing me or what...haha...amalkan hidup sihat

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-10-03 05:37 | Report Abuse

anbz, you are a fine gentleman. I have no personal grudge with you. I just offer my 2 cent to you in investing.

Remember if you want to build up your wealth in the stock market, you have to stand behind the shoulders of some of these investment giants:

“How many millionaires do you know who have become wealthy by investing in savings accounts? I rest my case.”
- Robert G. Allen

Hence one has to save and invest, the equity market is one of the good places to do it. But be wary of this statistics here (You learned statistic in U, didn't you?). Note that the period of this studies was a rising market.

[In their 2009 paper on “option trading and individual investor performance” , Rob Bauer, Mathijs Casemans and Piet Eichholtz examine the performance and persistence of individual investors trading at a Dutch online broker. Using a database consisting of more than 68,000 accounts and eight million trades in stocks during January 2000 to March 2006, they find that: During 2000-2006, the average investor has negative alphas, meaning the return is below the market return. Not even the top tenth of performance manages to beat the market consistently. Those in the bottom tenth of performance lose more than 90% of value.]

It is a jungle out there in the stock market. So what do you need to do? First you must armed yourself. Here are some of the things the giants said:

"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest": Benjamin Franklin

So go learn some basics in finance and investment such as how to read financial statements, some basic valuations etc. Believe me, they are much easier than statistics and calculus.

“I think you have to learn that there’s a company behind every stock.”
– Peter Lynch

So don't focus too much on price, the charts etc as trying to go in and out in the stock market is a loser game. It is speculating and you must know who you are speculating with. Remember what I quoted about the research about retail investors at the beginning of this long winded post? Follow what Ben Graham said below:

“The individual investor should act consistently as an investor and not as a speculator: Ben Graham

Focus on the company. Listen to what Greenblatt said about how to invest below:

•The secret to successful investing is to figure out the value of something and then-pay a lot less: Joel Greenblatt

Mr Market often behaves irrationally. When Mr Market is happy, the stock prices rise. When Mr Market gets moody, stocks fall. So it is easy to understand that if you know the business of the company well, and you want to build wealth, buy more when people sell cheap (if you can afford to), and sell to them when the price rises above its worth. Isn't that intuitive? Isn't that safer than the greater fools theory? Remember, you should be investing, not speculating. That is the only way you can be successful in the jungle out there.

So do not get distracted and listen to what Paul Samuelson said below:

“Investing should be more like watching paint dry or watching grass grow. If you want excitement, take $800 and go to Las Vegas.”
– Paul Samuelson

Posted by pradeep > 2013-10-03 09:48 | Report Abuse

KCCHONGNZ I see that you are very learned and others then KFIMA can you share your knowledge other stocks that we investors can invest. I really appreciate the advice you are giving us and if you are in New Zealand I would like to pay a holiday visit and have tea with you.

Posted by Hot.T > 2013-10-03 19:20 | Report Abuse

...please dont underestimate KFIMA and its pile of $$$.... :)

Posted by anbz > 2013-10-06 15:00 | Report Abuse

T for what ? boobs huh?

Posted by Fortunebull > 2013-10-06 15:06 | Report Abuse

KFima has been talk about as undervalue for too long! OMG! Fortunebull still remember 2 years back KFima also RM1.94!

Posted by iafx > 2013-10-06 15:07 | Report Abuse

hahahaa...

Posted by Fortunebull > 2013-10-06 15:11 | Report Abuse

Fortunebull tried to look ahead for rm1 margin! No hope! Maybe 4 year ago very hot growth, but not after GE13! Malai cronies not give business anymore!

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-10-06 15:28 | Report Abuse

umh, 2 years ago I bought Kfima at the price of RM1.48. How come people bought at 1.94 ah?

Aiseh, couldn't get the RM1 margin also.

Better buy Hibiscus lah. Rumours about striking black gold soon. RM5.00 also cheap man!

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-10-06 16:00 | Report Abuse

Posted by pradeep > Oct 3, 2013 09:48 AM | Report Abuse
KCCHONGNZ I see that you are very learned and others then KFIMA can you share your knowledge other stocks that we investors can invest. I really appreciate the advice you are giving us.

pradeep, I think you have posted a number of times addressed to me but i didn't reply you. So sorry. So I think I should at least give a response to you.

I am very poor in predicting where the share price of any stock will go. So I never venture into that "specialized" field. But I do have strong opinions regarding investing in the stock market, or rather the companies listed in Bursa. Instead of telling you which stocks to invest, i rather tell you my opinion what kind of stocks to invest, and how much you should pay for those stocks. Giving you a fishing rod is better than giving you 10 fish.

Contrary to many people think, investing is a very straightforward easy-to-do thing. Invest in good companies whose business would likely to last for many years to come. Good businesses have high margins in relation to their peers; high operating efficiencies in term of ROE, but I like the metric of ROIC better. And last but not least good cash flows.

A great company may not be a great investment if you pay high. Hence compare a stock price with its value, and have a margin of safety investing in them. Think of price-to-book, PE ratio etc. But I prefer the metric of enterprise value/Ebit. It is just that simple.

If you are interesting how to go about it, I invite you to go to a link in i3 below:

http://klse.i3investor.com/servlets/forum/900255072.jsp?ftp=1

Posted by pradeep > 2013-10-08 13:14 | Report Abuse

I appreciate your reply but confuse.To me it is team work not everybody is good in everything.My knowledge for Kfima if you go back to the records of this forum I gave my suggestion first. My friend did the research and he advice me to buy Kfima and I gave my opinion to all of you.I am still holding this stock and now the cash is up in Kfima ...Now I am watching Westport Malaysia listingand UMW oil and gas IPO closing date ion the 14th it is not easy to strike as most of the shares are taken up by the institutional. I dont have any accounts knowledge and very weak in mathematics.If someone brief me up on why should we buy the particular stock and if I am satisfied with the explanation and the risk I have to take then only I will decide whether to buy or not. That is the reason kcchongnz I ask you what other stocks we should invest no point of going hunting and fall into a trap. I know you speak facts which are true. I have been following your comments very closely and as far as Kfima is concern it is a germ, you are not wrong and can never be wrong on this particular stock.

Posted by Fortunebull > 2013-10-09 01:40 | Report Abuse

KCChongnz! I give my opinion not to attack you! Don't be defensive! I know KFima fundamentally strong but looking at technical side the bias of downtrend cannot be denied! I use fundamental to filter stocks looking for values! But also use technical to gain insight the demand of outstanding shares in open market! Fundamental to filter good or bad stocks, technical to filter 'hot' or 'cold' stocks! So when I assess potential of rm1 upside, I am looking at tehnical of demands! Plenty of undervalue stocks! Undervalue play no use in cold market only in hot market! I am very aggressive in margin!

Posted by Fortunebull > 2013-10-09 01:52 | Report Abuse

In efficient market hypothesis, theoretical of course what to see value reflected on shares! Fortunebull very dumb, so can made calculation and came out with intrinsic value for KFima at RM2.97! Wow! rm1 margin! My fat future profit! But studying the chart, disappointed! Only when heavy rout of selling, KFima manage to rebound! Then on steady slow downtrend! This is my opinion! Not attack on KCChongnz!

Posted by inwest88 > 2013-10-09 07:14 | Report Abuse

Fortunebull since you mentioned that there are so many undervalued stocks , why don't you just mention a few for the benefit of others. Would much appreciate.

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-10-09 08:19 | Report Abuse

Fortunebull, I don't know much about technical analysis, and I don't follow TA if you have read my posts. So no point arguing with me about it. I respect your opinion and your RM1 margin strategy. And you should also know not everybody admires charts.

You can criticize on my fundamental analysis. I welcome all constructive criticisms. Yes, no personal attack. For example if you get into personal on me like your comments below, please justify. Justify why you think I pretend to be smart. Justify why my valuation fails. I am happy to listen (read).

Do you have any hidden gem for 2013?
Oct 4, 2013 12:38 PM | Report Abuse
Ha! KCChongnz don't know anything! Pretending to be smart! Look at his Mahhsing valuation! Fail!

Posted by Fortunebull > 2013-10-09 09:09 | Report Abuse

Ha! You call me stupid fool!

Posted by kcchongnz > 2013-10-09 09:40 | Report Abuse

First you said I don't know anything and pretended to be smart.

Posted by Fortunebull > Oct 4, 2013 12:38 PM | Report Abuse
Ha! KCChongnz don't know anything! Pretending to be smart! Look at his Mahhsing valuation! Fail!

Then you said you follow my recommendations (what recommendations?).

Posted by Fortunebull > Oct 4, 2013 12:46 PM | Report Abuse
Read KCChongnz on Mahsing! He got his figures wrong! I follow his recommendations! Many stocks he put down has shot up!

Don't you think you deserve what I have said below after that?

Posted by kcchongnz > Oct 4, 2013 12:53 PM | Report Abuse X
Posted by Fortunebull > Oct 4, 2013 12:46 PM | Report Abuse
Read KCChongnz on Mahsing! He got his figures wrong! I follow his recommendations! Many stocks he put down has shot up!
You stupid fool. Why did you follow me and lost the opportunity to make killings in those stocks?
by the way, what "figures wrong" ah?

Why follow me if you think I know nothing and pretended to be smart? Some more blamed me?

Posted by Fortunebull > 2013-10-09 09:42 | Report Abuse

Ha! I follow KFima see if I missout making a killing!

Posted by pradeep > 2013-10-09 17:06 | Report Abuse

Fortune bull I don't agree with you and KCCHONGNZ is a gentlemen

Posted by pradeep > 2013-10-09 17:08 | Report Abuse

KCCHONGNZ looks like something is cooking in Kfima at can you guess?

Posted by KAHFIEHLAI > 2013-10-09 20:27 | Report Abuse

Pradeep...what is that?

Posted by Ooi Teik Bee > 2013-10-09 20:46 |

Post removed.Why?