Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 08:33 | Report Abuse

In addition, the mother share has dropped about 20% from the high but C24 has dropped 60% from 25c to 10c..........

Posted by Sslee > 2022-09-04 08:37 | Report Abuse

Some are actually ignorance of the facts and others are purposely distorted the facts to fit their agenda or to carry the ball of their master.

But when people start to believe these distorted facts what can we do?

"with great power comes great responsibility" - spider man

Education is power, the higher the education the higher the power.

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 08:41 |

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Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 08:43 |

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Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 08:45 | Report Abuse

These 2 naysayer cannot move the share price with their stories......the IBs could......and they are shorting.......

Posted by tehka > 2022-09-04 08:48 | Report Abuse

With all 3 cracks futures (diesel, jet fuel, mogas92) all up by a lot on Friday, and impact on European oil refineries as mentioned by probability, with tomorrow being the start of a new week, good feeling on Hengyuan and Petronm tomorrow.

Posted by eagerinvestor > 2022-09-04 08:50 | Report Abuse

hedging a 12-24 mths derivatives is like locking in a long term oil contract. its normal why all the fuss?

Posted by tehka > 2022-09-04 08:51 | Report Abuse

Wish everyone a good week ahead

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 08:52 |

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Posted by tehka > 2022-09-04 08:55 | Report Abuse

@Bob, technically IB should buy more mother share to hedge against the CW going up, but it seems like they also employ naysayers to bombard i3 forums.

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 08:57 |

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Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 08:58 |

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Posted by i3lurker > 2022-09-04 08:59 | Report Abuse

01/01/2023 EU Sanctions on Russia, Comprehensive Final Package

Global Supply & Demand is just irritated and not affected.
what will happen is all Russian oil will be dumped to China.
China purchases of WTI & Brent will be reduced proportionally by the amount of cheap Russian Oil bought.
Europe rather than sourcing from cheap Russian Oil now has to buy from their "other enemy", those guys across the Channel.

Global Oil will spike momentarily purely due to "feelings""
No "real" effects on oil industry.
All Malaysian Gloves will go bankrupt though as butadiene prices will drop for China Gloves due to cheap Russian oil.
Butadiene prices for Malaysian Gloves will remain high as it will be produced from high oil price.


0X/0X/202X Comprehensive Nuclear Agreement with Iran.

This will be signed despite Israel objections as it was previously signed by Democrats and another Democrat will sign it.
Unless they pow wow until Democrats lose both Houses in the Mid Terms.

Posted by JerichomyFatherDies > 2022-09-04 09:00 | Report Abuse

Ini pagi PAPA Jerichomy hum ka charn .Bunuh diri sebab Jerichomy tidur dan KONG KEK emak sendiri.Mak Jerichomy hisap lan chiooJerichomy.Laporsn Mahbur Rahman

Posted by JerichomyFatherDies > 2022-09-04 09:01 | Report Abuse

Pagi HAN KHA CHARN 4 orang keluarga Jerichomy

Posted by JerichomyFatherDies > 2022-09-04 09:02 | Report Abuse

Sembayang kencing dan tahi bagi EMAK Jerichomy yang mati.Emak Jerichomy sudah tua di RO GOL olih 5 bangkala

Posted by stockraider > 2022-09-04 09:02 | Report Abuse

Why General Raider says Sifu Sslee analysis on Hengyuan is dangerous flawed ?

1. Looking at the balance sheet HRC hedging losses as at 30-6-2022 amounted to rm Rm 1,329M of this sum of losses Rm 1189m or 90% are contributed by just 6 mths of operation result for the latest 30-6-2022 Financial result loh!

2. HRC derivative outstanding liabilities todate is Rm 1,781M whereas is derivative assets is Rm 261m, meaning net derivative negative exposure is Rm 1,520M.....meaning the counter party should be able received payment of Rm 1,520M from Hengyuan, it is just like your share margin losses loh!

3. Then why counterparty did not ask for margin call , since HRC has a huge negative equity of Rm 1520M leh ? Yes the counter party did ask for margin top up and hengyuan already paid, this can be seen from other receivable & prepayment payout increases by Rm 1,542M for the 6 mths mah!

In otherwords, Hengyuan 6 mths operating cashflow b4 working capital changes should be Rm 939m, after less Rm 1542M derivative top up amounting to negative cashflow of Rm 603M mah!

The route to potential financial collapse of Hengyuan, are written all there in the Derivative mah!

Do not get into this trap loh! Despite Hengyuan generated record positive operation cash flow of Rm 939m, its negative cashflow from derivative losses is rm 1,542m ( which already payout as other prepayment} thus HRC negative cashflow is Rm 603M.

Most importantly, Hengyuan borrowing & derivative liabilities had ballooned to Rm 3285M from just Rm 705m as at 31-12-2021 which a staggering increase of Rm 2580M, just within 6 mths and of this sum Rm 1542M is due to margin top up of derivative losses in the form of prepayment mah!

Lu tau boh ? The rot of Hengyuan has intensified alot loh!
Be very careful mah!

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:05 | Report Abuse

Hahahaha...one sided Accounting.....IGNORED.

Posted by Mikecyc > 2022-09-04 09:07 | Report Abuse

Referred to Latest Q2 Report ended June 2022 :

1. Non Current Asset :

Derivative financial assets. RM 14,363,000

2. Current Asset :

Derivative financial assets. RM 247,598,000

3. Non Current Liabilities :

Derivative financial liabiliti RM 480,908,000

4. Current Liabilities :

Derivati financial liabilitie RM 1,305,569,000

>>

Cash flow hedge reserve ( 543,706,000 )
Cost of hedging reserve. ( 786,566,000 )


Borrowing : 1,500,466,000

Capital n Reserve : 1,576,380,000

Gearing Ratio : 0.952

————————————-


Referred to Q1 Report ended March 2022 :

1. Non Current Asset :

Derivative financial assets. RM 2,976,000

2. Current Asset :

Derivative financial assets. RM 158,102,000

3. Non Current Liabilities :

Derivative financial liabiliti RM 42,581,000

4. Current Liabilities :

Derivati financial liabilitie RM 1,452,913,000

>>>

Cash flow hedge reserve ( 299,007,000 )
Cost of hedging reserve. 48,335,000


Borrowing : 1,452,913,000

Capital n Reserve : 1,988,495,000

Gearing Ratio : 0.731



Q1 :

Cash flow hedge reserve ( 299,007,000 )
Cost of hedging reserve. 48,335,000

Q2 :

Cash flow hedge reserve ( 543,706,000 )
Cost of hedging reserve. ( 786,566,000 )

Posted by stockraider > 2022-09-04 09:07 | Report Abuse

All these info Raider presented is supported by fact & figures mah!

U can check it for yourself, since Raider had given direction where to Check Mah!

Lu tau boh ?

Posted by Mikecyc > 2022-09-04 09:08 |

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Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:10 | Report Abuse

Did you also check the proposed 5 Billion Notes from Hibiscus many, many moons ago........hahahaha..........Oil companies may try, but would it materalise????

Posted by tehka > 2022-09-04 09:10 | Report Abuse

Haiyoh, hengyuan so bad kah raider? Like that you better sell off all your Petron and move to non refinery loh! Hengyuan and Petron always move in tandem one. If Hengyuan is crashed, petron also gone case loh!

Posted by i3lurker > 2022-09-04 09:11 | Report Abuse

Continuation

01/01/2023 EU Sanctions on Russia, Comprehensive Final Package

China Cost of Production will drop across the board.
Cheap Russian oil dumped to China means all raw materials in China will be cheaper.
Example, plastics, fertilizers, electronic devices, EV cars etc etc
A global reduction in prices due to lower China manufacturing costs will spark a Global Non-Russian economic boom

The same cycle will happen to food as Russian wheat dumped to China will reduce China purchases from US.
Just switching musical chairs.

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:14 |

Post removed.Why?

Posted by stockraider > 2022-09-04 09:15 | Report Abuse

I think the Rm 5b sukuk notes will be likely be rejected of the financier analyse Hengyuan Deeper loh!

Since Maybank latest had already provided big increases in Provision for Loan Bad debts, they will be very cautious in assessing HENGYUAN financial position loh!

With this type of weakness....the future demise of Hengyuan will come sooner rather than later mah!

Posted by UlarSawa > 2022-09-04 09:16 | Report Abuse

Haiyoh facts n figures again. Wei. Judi saham end result want to win is more important leh. Facts n Figures are secondary leh. Haiyoh. Correct?

Posted by stockraider > 2022-09-04 09:16 | Report Abuse

U can do the same checking on Petron mah!

Petron is prudently financial manage loh!

Posted by Mikecyc > 2022-09-04 09:16 |

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Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:17 |

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Posted by stockraider > 2022-09-04 09:18 | Report Abuse

Surely u must rely on fact & figures eventually lah, U cannot always rely on "Magic" all the time mah!

Correct ??

Posted by UlarSawa > 33 seconds ago | Report Abuse

Haiyoh facts n figures again. Wei. Judi saham end result want to win is more important leh. Facts n Figures are secondary leh. Haiyoh. Correct?

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:20 |

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Posted by Mikecyc > 2022-09-04 09:22 |

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Posted by stockraider > 2022-09-04 09:22 | Report Abuse

U all need to understand this loh!

Is such a derivative losses for Hengyuan is really true or is it a device to siphon money via the derivative leh ?

Always REMEMBER THIS LOH!

Petron reported a positive position after flowing thru its hedging losses to the P&L top line, this should be what hedging operation should be all about by smoothing out its profitability but not in hengyuan case with losses run into billions ?

But hengyuan do not loh! It keep the hedging loss as no impact to EPS loh!

If we standardised the treatment like Petron....Hengyuan will be reporting huge losses loh!

Rightfully Hedging losses should flow thru P&L mah!

Thus Hengyuan performance appear very bad compare to Petron loh!

The most danger question is the hedging instrument is completely unrelated to business hedging but it is a device instrument to siphon money from hengyuan loh!

The red flags can be seen by;

1. Many qtr of hedging losses loh!
2. Very suspicious long dated of the hedging instrument loh!
3. Extremely large hedging value has been contracted mah!
4. Extremely Huge hedging losses incurred todate loh!

If the above suspicion is proven true.....then hengyuan will eventually be worthless just like Serba loh!

Posted by UlarSawa > 2022-09-04 09:22 | Report Abuse

Debt 1.5bil due in 4months. Need to find money to pay money leh. How to find the money. Borrow new money to pay old debt lah. 5bil notes purpose is for this kah. Even want to pay 10sen divvy also need to borrow money to pay one leh. Mana ada possible keep paying divvy like this leh. No wonder profit 667 mil only can pay 30mil divvy leh. Haiyoh. Correct?

Posted by stockraider > 2022-09-04 09:24 | Report Abuse

Most importantly just within 6 mths Rm 1542m is payout due to margin call in respect of derivative losses mah!

Lu tau boh ?

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:25 | Report Abuse

Imagine this scenario........China is also a major Oil producer and exporter. They are kept afloat with Russian Oil and reduce local production. Russia Oil is cheaper by 30%. China keep enough for themselves and sell the balance to open market, except EU which now belongs to Iran.
There would not be any shortfall from China's reduced pumping??????

Posted by UlarSawa > 2022-09-04 09:25 | Report Abuse

Derivative can lose 1bil is not normal lah. Mgmt is very poor in hedging leh. Need to get an expert to replace the current person who is incompetence one leh else future is getting worst leh. Haiyoh. Correct?

Posted by UlarSawa > 2022-09-04 09:26 | Report Abuse

Bill Hwang Had $20 Billion, Then Lost It All in Two Days
The fast rise and even faster fall of a trader who bet big with borrowed money.

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:27 | Report Abuse

Wow!....naysayers from Shorties group all out this morning.....hehehehe

Posted by UlarSawa > 2022-09-04 09:27 | Report Abuse

Before he lost it all—all $20 billion—Bill Hwang was the greatest trader you’d never heard of.

Starting in 2013, he parlayed more than $200 million left over from his shuttered hedge fund into a mind-boggling fortune by betting on stocks. Had he folded his hand in early March and cashed in, Hwang, 57, would have stood out among the world’s billionaires. There are richer men and women, of course, but their money is mostly tied up in businesses, real estate, complex investments, sports teams, and artwork. Hwang’s $20 billion net worth was almost as liquid as a government stimulus check. And then, in two short days, it was gone.

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:28 | Report Abuse

Betting in Hedging and lose money is normal.....

Hedging in business for real and not leave to chance can lose money.....then better close shop.

Posted by UlarSawa > 2022-09-04 09:28 | Report Abuse

Hedge Fund D1 Borrowed Billions for a Hot Bet That Now Faces Reckoning
The firm borrowed money to buy stakes in private companies and posted massive gains. But as valuations fade, such bullishness is veering into losses across the industry.

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:29 |

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Posted by UlarSawa > 2022-09-04 09:29 | Report Abuse

Hedge funds were tallying gains on their hottest bet in years when Dan Sundheim reached an unusual deal with JPMorgan Chase & Co. to go even further.

With the bank’s help in August 2020, Sundheim’s D1 Capital Partners used its stakes in private companies as collateral for borrowing $2 billion that the firm could put toward yet more of those stakes, among other things. Last year that focus on private companies looked brilliant, as D1 updated its valuations and posted a whopping 70% gain in that part of its portfolio.

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:30 | Report Abuse

I must have said something right about the IB and shorting........arrows from all directions!

Posted by Mikecyc > 2022-09-04 09:30 | Report Abuse

BoarD oF DireCTors

Wang, YouDe
Chairman
Non-Independent Non-Executive Director
Wang, ZongQuan
Deputy Chairman
Non-Independent Non-Executive Director
Alan Hamzah Sendut
Independent Non-Executive Director
Fauziah Hisham
Independent Non-Executive Director
Liang Kok Siang
Independent Non-Executive Director
Surinderdeep Singh Mohindar Singh
Independent Non-Executive Director

Posted by BobAxelrod > 2022-09-04 09:30 | Report Abuse

Shorties are after meeee....!!!

Posted by tehka > 2022-09-04 09:31 | Report Abuse

Haiyah Bob, naysayers mind cannot change mind one, you waste your energy. Better just chill like ular. Correct?

Posted by UlarSawa > 2022-09-04 09:31 | Report Abuse

Haiyoh not gamble then why loss in hedging so big amount leh. Now even want to issue notes of 5bil leh. Debt balloon to 1.5bil now leh. Haiyoh. Correct?


BobAxelrod

I repeat....HY is not a gambler.....he doesn't Bet on Hedging.......

12 seconds ago