Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-18 20:17 | Report Abuse

That is why the full year result will be same or slightly better than last year

Posted by shareinvestment7 > 2022-03-18 22:48 | Report Abuse

I think UP is using forward contract to hedge his refinery segment. Those player with upstream and downstream business such as KLK, Sime Plant also has forward contact as hedging. I think they are hedging for downstream business. SOP and Taann are purely upstream player, hence, they hardly have any forward contract sales.

Posted by drt6398 > 2022-03-18 23:01 | Report Abuse

before complaining on the forward selling management, anyone actually noted regarding the dividen payout during low cpo price? i would say that it's been quite consistent. it depends on what you're looking for in your investment, UP is not suitable for short term trading nevertheless. many plantation counters have gone through new low during the pandemic without any dividen. correct me if i am wrong

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-18 23:53 | Report Abuse

Aiyoyo, long term investor cannot discuss about the company's hedging method meh? It's not complaining, It's about facts. Their method works during down cycle, but don't you think the management need to make some adjustment on their hedging method during up cycle.

You long term one ar? Long term see candle one ar?

Stock: [MFCB]: MEGA FIRST CORP BHD

May 28, 2021 2:40 PM | Report Abuse

hopefully another candle to break rm8 today

Posted by drt6398 > 2022-03-19 17:37 | Report Abuse

This is forum for utdplt..no point for personal attacking by picking comments from other counters. Different counters need different strategies

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-19 18:35 | Report Abuse

Oh, now someone just realized it's a forum woh!!!! Cannot do personal attacking woh, also cannot discuss about weakness of the company woh!!!!! Discussion will be regard as complaining wor........ Please go and check with admin lo, see got this type of rules or not ma?

Posted by shareinvestment7 > 2022-03-19 21:20 | Report Abuse

Next month 26/4/2022 is UP virtual AGM. We can throw all our doubts to management through the virtual platform. Let’s see what are their replies.

Posted by somo1 > 2022-03-24 11:27 | Report Abuse

Yup, their finance/ treasury people are incompetent entering so called hedging activities without using their brains! Should they never learn and repeat the $140 million losses in shorting futures in their so called hedging activities. These people should be held accountable or be sacked from the jobs!

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-24 14:47 | Report Abuse

somo 1, please tell it to the management during AGM.

Posted by Pinky > 2022-03-24 15:48 | Report Abuse

U cannot have your cake and eat it.

If management do not have a policy of hedging, profitability will swing wildly, so UP will not get the reputation it has always enjoyed as the plantation company with consistent profitability and generous dividends.

Posted by Lyo82 > 2022-03-24 16:16 | Report Abuse

That is the main reason I pick UP in my portfolio: Hedging for stability and consistent income. You can combine it with another plantation company that sell at spot price if you think UP is overly boring, cheers.

Posted by Pinky > 2022-03-24 17:38 | Report Abuse

@Lyo82 that is why I combo UP with Ta Ann

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-24 17:38 | Report Abuse

Pinky, Lyo82 what you said is correct because I bought it for the same reasons.
I do not expect them to have a an ASP of 5k like other companies.
But forward contract for 12 month and above for this year is really a mistake.
Last year it's only 5.6k whereas this year is 62K. It's that what you call consistency nad stability? As for 6 to 12 mths hedging, last year was only 10k, this year is 58k.
That is why I'm saying they are getting too complacent n did not do their job properly.

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-24 17:54 | Report Abuse

I would say they are doing an excellent job in managing the plantation but a shitty job in hedging.

Posted by somo1 > 2022-03-25 16:28 | Report Abuse

Not really sure they're hedging their risks. It appears they simply take a view on the CPO market believing the CPO prices have gone up excessively, as seen in their comments made in the 3Q2021 notes and AR2021, hence selling forward CPO contracts. That's taking a BET but wrapping it up in the name of hedging. And their decision on such bet obviously had gone very wrong, and the worst thing that they seem NOT to realize they're wrong and continue to thread along the same pathway. As for their refineries， Unitata, Unifuji, if they really want to lock in their purchase prices for raw materials and have a better control on their input costing, they should be LONG the CPO contracts and NOT shorting them, right? Really couldn't see how could they qualify these activities as hedging, instead they brought onto themselves more risks by double-down on SHORTING CPO futures.

Posted by LossAversion > 2022-03-25 16:50 | Report Abuse

UP has been doing an excellent job in ensuring that their products are sustainable (from farm to table), and continue to have "locked-in" demand from Europe, or to "feed" the Danish operations. Just visit their operations and one will no doubt have a better understanding of why UP differs from the rest of PO producers/processors.

Posted by somo1 > 2022-03-25 16:57 | Report Abuse

Totally in agreement . No dispute at all on their excellence in operations and the way they manage their plantations. But their finance/ Treasury department is really weak, really remote from sophistication. What a pity! Really hope they can reform in that regards.

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-25 18:32 | Report Abuse

somo 1, by Q3 last year, everyone in the oil seed industry already know La Lina already hit South America again. Canada rapeseed is tight. Malaysia CPO selling at US 1079 in July 2021.
All these info are easily accessible.
I just cannot believe they just went ahead to hedge the 7-12months, above 12 months production in such a large quantity as compare to 2020.
I just have the impression that UP think excellent in operation is good enough but just don't care about maximizing the profit by financial means. OR maybe some hanky panky in their forward selling.

Posted by somo1 > 2022-03-25 19:55 | Report Abuse

...and now with the commodity markets adjust upward to the QE or over-printing of the greenback on top of the expected food shortage as the result of the Russian/Ukrainian crisis... They've got to be blind to engage in such mindless forward selling of CPO and in total disregard of shareholders' interests. Even if they want to lock in good prices as they seem fit, under current extraordinary circumstances, they should sell forward in small batches and not go too far out in tenors, 3 months forward should be fine and considered prudent. The current "hedging" they're doing, I'll call it reckless and in total contrast to their conservative and prudent corporate image.

Posted by somo1 > 2022-03-25 19:58 | Report Abuse

Ooihk899, your suspicion is not without reasons. Probably... but only the insiders can be sure of...

Posted by somo1 > 2022-03-25 20:10 | Report Abuse

Another, if I remember correctly when browsing thru their AR, they held over 100 million ringgit worth of bond funds/ unit trusts. They're already starting experiencing capital losses， which they rightfully recognized as bond yields started to rise. Yet, they're still hanging on to such investment, knowing very well bank Negara will surely raise rates in the 2H2022, negative investment return from those bond funds will deepen. Nevertheless, losses from those investment would not be material, just a few million ringgits. But hey, to be prudent, well managed and fully accountable to shareholders, they ought to switch out from the bond funds NOW and move them to strictly Money Market funds with no exposure to instruments having tenors longer than 12 months. Every penny counts!

Posted by Pinky > 2022-03-25 20:12 | Report Abuse

Complaining about UP's losses from hedging during commodities bull cycle is like complaining why Cycle & Carriage Bintang didn't sell Hondas and Toyotas so that they could sell more cars to the middle income market, or complaining why UOA Development Berhad didn't build more low cost homes so that their homes could sell more easily.

Posted by Fabien _the efficient capital allocator > 2022-03-25 21:15 | Report Abuse

UP is counter cyclical. Up swing in commodity prices is not good for them. They are built to survive and thrive even in the down cycle.

Posted by Fabien _the efficient capital allocator > 2022-03-25 21:17 | Report Abuse

But having said that, im confident UP will record a better profit this year compared to last year. A repeat of windfall dividend of RM1.15 is highly probable.

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-25 21:23 | Report Abuse

Aiyoyo, Pinky, angry oledi lo until compare apple with durian ar. Is producing and selling palm oil same as selling car or house???
If we said their finance dept. is shitty, we must provide facts and discuss ma. That's not complain wor. Forum is for discussion ma. Good points on the company by now everyone also know but weakness.... or we prefer 'sky is the limit talk'.

Posted by Pinky > 2022-03-25 21:27 | Report Abuse

I'm not angry. I'm just saying that the criticism is unmerited.

It's like seeing Proton enjoying high sales on X70 or Perodua enjoying good sales on Myvi and criticising C&C Bintang why didn't sell cars meant for mass market.

Similarly if you didn't look into P&L details and just look at earnings and dividends you should have no complaints.

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-25 22:24 | Report Abuse

Pinky, did CPO has many model or different brand or car has derivatives???? Don't compare apple to durian.
Of course dividend is one of the reason we invest in this company. Do you think FY 2022 dividend growth with be the same as FY 2021? Don't you think If they manage their hedging better, we can get more dividend this year and FY2023?

Posted by dam82 > 2022-03-25 22:41 | Report Abuse

wah so much interest in UTDPLT now ... which is good ... on hedging there is no right or wrong but UTDPLT management is very conservatize so highly unlikely they will change their approach since for them this was proven approach for them for a long time .
Can’t deny the profit would be more if they change their hedge policy but I am comfortable with their approach so long I get my dividend at this rate ..anyone whom not happy with their approach please grab a beer and chill down but make sure its Carlsberg .. saying that I will collect more after ex dividend price and hope it goes down more .

Posted by Pinky > 2022-03-26 09:42 | Report Abuse

I was using different car model/marketing strategy to illustrate different management strategies of different companies

Posted by ooihk899 > 2022-03-26 11:20 | Report Abuse

Pinky, commodity and car/house are different thing, its apple and durian, hence nothing to illustrate.

Posted by Pinky > 2022-03-26 11:30 | Report Abuse

hahahahaha okay i rest my case bye

Posted by DestinyL > 2022-03-30 16:07 | Report Abuse

A closer analogy would be proton selling the same x70 locally as well as overseas. Overseas selling at loss even if it is the exact same car blablabla. And now they keep selling more overseas, perhaps to try to build brand image for their future

Posted by LongTermInvestor8 > 2022-03-31 18:16 | Report Abuse

what's up with the delayed QR? like almost 1 month already. why?

Posted by shareinvestment7 > 2022-03-31 20:21 | Report Abuse

Are you a newbie in UP?

Posted by somo1 > 2022-04-01 11:14 | Report Abuse

Non-stop selling by EPF. Looks like by end of this month, as long as there're takers, EPF shall turn itself into a minority shareholder! That's when UP prices can see a sustainable uptrend. Till then...

Posted by DestinyL > 2022-04-03 16:59 | Report Abuse

Till then, enjoy the divvy

Posted by somo1 > 2022-04-04 11:34 | Report Abuse

See if EPF will emerge in the afternoon. If not, this stock cum dividend can only sail north!

Posted by Diamond7 > 2022-04-04 20:41 | Report Abuse

Strong.,..very strong!
85 cents dividend soon!

Posted by soon9913 > 2022-04-06 20:45 | Report Abuse

hold tight.. this year will be giving another record dividend

Posted by gohku > 2022-04-07 08:16 | Report Abuse

Great buy, high dividend yield. Hold tight.

Posted by Pinky > 2022-04-07 15:26 | Report Abuse

Okay, I topped up for the bumper divvy

Posted by Denmark > 2022-04-08 09:32 | Report Abuse

What date is The dividend coming

Posted by stockraider > 2022-04-08 09:34 | Report Abuse

Very fine dividend payout for Uplant loh!

Posted by Pinky > 2022-04-08 09:38 | Report Abuse

Ex date 28 April. Pay end of May

Aiya sendiri go Announcements page see la

Posted by Pinky > 2022-04-08 09:38 | Report Abuse

https://klse.i3investor.com/web/stock/entitlement/2089

Posted by Denmark > 2022-04-08 10:24 | Report Abuse

Thanks

Posted by Pinky > 2022-04-08 10:29 | Report Abuse

UTDPLT is cash rich and has a generous dividend policy

See page 17 here:
https://klse.i3investor.com/web/staticfile/view/452312

The Board has on 6 November 2021 adopted a dividend
policy, whereby we shall endeavour to have an annual
dividend (interim and final) payout ratio between 70%
- 80%. Any dividend above the payout ratio shall be
declared as special or extraordinary dividend.

Posted by Pinky > 2022-04-08 10:30 | Report Abuse

So u won't have funny decisions by Board to "retain cash" for funny reasons

Posted by LossAversion > 2022-04-08 11:38 | Report Abuse

This is one stock that I have NO WORRIES at all, irrespective of CPO prices. Keep this gem for years without having any worries of fall or rise.

Posted by stockraider > 2022-04-08 12:03 | Report Abuse

UP is the bluest of bluechip plantation stock mah!